where did all the tanks go?

[Shadowneko]

My problem is different than the guy with the WHM problem...I can find those I just can't find anyone who wants to tank on my server. My summoner is lvl 41(not that Summoner is easy to get invites with) so I go to make my own and I see no Ninjas, Pallys or even a stray warrior on seek!

I rank my Tanks if I'm looking:

1. Ninja- I hate main healing because I'm a Summoner and see this as the job of real WHMs or perhaps an RDM companion. A coupls of shadows means I don't have to cure as much.

2. Palidin- yeah they cure themsevles...I love that!

3. Warrior- got pegged as a DD as of late but a stray one or two can still tank.

(I just can't find any of these people)

[Nazo]

Yeah I'm having the same problem trying to level my 49 drk. Either there's no rdm / brd, no tank, no healer or a glut of other more preferred DDs.

[Wise Donkey]

I think part of the reason is you are past 37. I imagine most people who have a desire to take NIN farther than SJ level have already done so. As a WAR I love Tanking - but I haven't been asked to do so since Valkurm Dunes. People tend to forget that a WAR can tank if they prepare for it properly.

[Malacite]

This is totally off topic and I apologize for it, but shadow, what IS that CUTE!!!!!!!!!! (ZOMG) little thing in your avatar pic?

[Wise Donkey]

This is totally off topic and I apologize for it, but shadow, what IS that CUTE!!!!!!!!!! (ZOMG) little thing in your avatar pic?

Looks like a Pokemon.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

My problem is different than the guy with the WHM problem...I can find those I just can't find anyone who wants to tank on my server. My summoner is lvl 41(not that Summoner is easy to get invites with) so I go to make my own and I see no Ninjas, Pallys or even a stray warrior on seek!

I rank my Tanks if I'm looking:

1. Ninja- I hate main healing because I'm a Summoner and see this as the job of real WHMs or perhaps an RDM companion. A coupls of shadows means I don't have to cure as much.

2. Palidin- yeah they cure themsevles...I love that!

3. Warrior- got pegged as a DD as of late but a stray one or two can still tank.

(I just can't find any of these people)

Well, part of the problem is that you already "rate" other jobs. If you're turning away jobs because you don't like to main heal, then you can expect a difficult time finding/building PTs. Since you want to play a certain way, you'll have to build a PT around your desired function.

I might prefer a NIN tank as COR or BRD, but that's not always an option that's open. And if you're holding out for a RDM or BRD when a COR is seeking, you're only robbing yourself of time.

I remember when people would hold up completing a PT setup just because they wanted an RNG (this was back before the nerf in CoP). I sometimes left a PT before we left Jeuno because leaders would wait up do a half hour for a RNG to pop. It was infuriating. And don't get me started on how that inflated RNG egos.

[Dwarkyzidez]

hm, yeah. When I took my RDM and BLM through valkurm this month I noticed a decrease in tanking jobs. Maybe nobody wants to tank anymore?

But really...you shouldnt complain about the tanks. They all have their ups and downs. As a RDM, I liked PLD since I didnt cure alot, and with NINs you have to cure anyways.

[Aksannyi]

where did all the tanks go?

Iraq?

All kidding aside, I have noticed this trend as well, but I've found that parties have been better lately so it all balances out.

And I think some of them went to Afghanistan, too. ;)

[Murphie]

With only two to three real tanking jobs in the game, it's not surprising that they are hard to come by. Most people who are leveling tanks get snatched up really quickly, leaving everyone else standing around waiting for another to "spawn". The best way to get around the dearth of tanks? Level a tank job yourself.

[Clever Ninja]

We're all busy leveling NIN sub because the norm now is TP burns.

That or they're like me and leveling RDM >___________>.

[Quetzalcoatl]

im PLD and i love tank but i think that if u cant find a pld a nin or a war/nin maybe u can ask a mnk the high VIT make them good tanks with a good whm or rdm healing so dont close the door to other jobs i hv seen brd/nin tanking so keep serching boy /cheer

[LyonheartLakshmi]

im PLD and i love tank but i think that if u cant find a pld a nin or a war/nin maybe u can ask a mnk the high VIT make them good tanks with a good whm or rdm healing so dont close the door to other jobs i hv seen brd/nin tanking so keep serching boy /cheer
The "open mindedness" on tanks is hard to crack on both sides. Not only do many people avoid WAR/MNK blood tanks like the plague, but it's often hard to convince a WAR to tank. I'm guessing it's even rarer to find a MNK (especially ones past lvl 37) who would be willing to blood tank.

Unless you find one who's into counter tanking. I'm sure a pimped out MNK who has tons of gil sunk into +counter gear would love the opportunity to show off by main tanking.

[Shadowneko]

This is totally off topic and I apologize for it, but shadow, what IS that CUTE!!!!!!!!!! (ZOMG) little thing in your avatar pic?


off topic: It's a cute little dragon from an Anime called "Dragon Drive" and I own the DVDs ^^


On topic: I just sorta ranked the tanks. I'll invite anything for DDs as long as I have 1 good tank and some good mages. Then again I'll settle for anyone tanking XD

[eticket109]

I used to joke that PLD would be my bloodwarp job and I'd never level it. I started it up though recently and am really enjoying it. I put it on hold for a bit to level WHM, but I think I may actually take PLD to 75 some day.

[Mouser]

It's kind of sad. I keep VIT gear around for my WAR on the off chance someone will be desperate enough to let me tank as WAR/MNK at level 73 (after all, most mobs are VT anyway, perfect WAR/MNK fodder). But the last few times I've been in a party and offered, the leaders preferred to wait 30+ minutes for a "real" tank (i.e NIN, or grudgingly PLD) to pop. Oh well, I guess if people want me to be a mindless killer, I can't complain.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

I've always wanted to play WAR as tank and enjoyed doing so when allowed to. I might consider starting a new character and a static that would play the game as though Zilart and the subsequent expansions never existed just so I can experience being a WAR tank.

It was a tank, it can be a tank, mages are just too damned lazy to do their jobs and support that kind of tanking.

[IfritnoItazura]

How would you set up a static party going Lv.10 to 75 with a WAR tank? I'm curious...

Edit: I mean, which other jobs would you put in the party.

[dspeed]

Well I see the same trend too. But I think is harder to find a whm than a tank. Alot of time when I wanna lvl my thf I can find everything except a whm. And that force me to either solo some of my other jobs or just lvl my lower lvl jobs

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

How would you set up a static party going Lv.10 to 75 with a WAR tank? I'm curious...

Edit: I mean, which other jobs would you put in the party.

I'd just go with the classics.

WAR, MNK, THF, BLM, WHM. RDM.

I've actually discussed this with some friends and we may do it. Rules would be no Zilart or Aht'Urgan jobs, even under sub, no entry into expansion areas or genkai 1 until Shadow Lord is defeated. Gear we'd be a little more lienient on as some of the original armors may or may not be as available as they used to be, same with food.

After Genkai 1, Zilart and ToA jobs could be subbed and we'd go to expansion zones as needed, but the main jobs wouldn't change. WAR would always be tank. I'd personally like to try WAR/SAM above all others.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

How would you set up a static party going Lv.10 to 75 with a WAR tank? I'm curious...

Edit: I mean, which other jobs would you put in the party.
3 melee (one of them being WAR) + 3 mages, perhaps? Make the 3 Mages WHM + RDM + BRD. Pick the other 2 melees to be whatever SC setup you want. I suppose you could pick THF and MNK, to SATA hate onto WAR/NIN tank. But WAR/MNK could work just as well, provided you convince your static not to overhunt.

[Aksannyi]

I'd just go with the classics.

WAR, MNK, THF, BLM, WHM. RDM.

I've actually discussed this with some friends and we may do it. Rules would be no Zilart or Aht'Urgan jobs, even under sub, no entry into expansion areas or genkai 1 until Shadow Lord is defeated. Gear we'd be a little more lienient on as some of the original armors may or may not be as available as they used to be, same with food.

After Genkai 1, Zilart and ToA jobs could be subbed and we'd go to expansion zones as needed, but the main jobs wouldn't change. WAR would always be tank. I'd personally like to try WAR/SAM above all others.
That would be a lot of fun to try. I've got a few newbie mules - I could pick one of them to level in such a way.

[IfritnoItazura]

WAR, MNK, THF, BLM, WHM. RDM.
[...]
After Genkai 1, Zilart and ToA jobs could be subbed and we'd go to expansion zones as needed, but the main jobs wouldn't change. WAR would always be tank. I'd personally like to try WAR/SAM above all others.

Hmm. Is there a decent SC for the BLM and RDM to MB on for much of the levels? I guess a WAR can use a polearm or two-handed sword to open Distortion for the THF, or a one-handed sword to open Fusion for MNK, but it seems like you're partial to two-handed Axe (like me).

It would be sad if this "classic" party can't be efficiently played under the SC+MB style. >_>;

Also, can WAR/SAM tank hold the monster from MNK? With no Cover, at best you'd have a few seconds from WHM's Flash.

[Murphie]

Yeah, it's kind of disappointing that the basic jobs can't really make the good skillchains for much of the early part of the game. Unless they use odd weapons, that is.

Still, it's an intriguing idea.

[I'm just a guy]

hehe, a while back, err along while back alot of mnks would be tanks.. but now they are all considerd DDs. With the right gear they tank pretty well and all, just youll not find much that will go for it now =\

[Akashimo]

Actually before I fully started monk, I've thought of them as tanks just because of their rank in eva is right under nin, and how good counter can be. Leveling, it is easy to pull hate of most tanks. Quicksands gaves from 42 to 46 I've counterstance tank beetles easily seeing how the nin can't keep hate off the blm, muchless myself. Waiting til I reach 70 and do an O-hat run for completing my tank set I'm setting aside for nin aswell.

There is alot of resistance against the use of anything less than pld or nin in my experience. But even THF/NIN or THF/WAR can take and hold hate easily depending on the setup. Usually in a thf/ninx2 with a /thf hate is insanely easy to control and not work about voking. A+ eva, evasion bonus can easily chain Ni against most mobs. ^^; RDM/WAR next best to pld using def food, eva/def gear together, Phalanx, Stoneskin and Defender can make stoneskin take quite a beating but when it goes down, stun/flash and its back up and ready for more. Ice Spikes best way in my eyes to hold hate too along with keeping para up ^^

[Truece]

It was a tank, it can be a tank, mages are just too damned lazy to do their jobs and support that kind of tanking.

Careful here... It is not necessarily the fault of lazy mages, but also lazy WARs who just don't want to tank.

The entire population would need to accept that WARs can (and should) tank. If the WAR isn't geared properly, however, you are looking at a lot of down-time. At least more down time than you would (probably) experience with PLD or NIN tanks.

I have a feeling that mages aren't the only ones who would scoff at WAR tanks simply because of current XP trends. There's no doubt in my mind that it can be done, but I think that a majority of the player base has stereotyped WAR solely as DD and would hesitate to participate in such a party (unfortunately).

[BlackSerenade]

My problem is different than the guy with the WHM problem...I can find those I just can't find anyone who wants to tank on my server. My summoner is lvl 41(not that Summoner is easy to get invites with) so I go to make my own and I see no Ninjas, Pallys or even a stray warrior on seek!

I rank my Tanks if I'm looking:

1. Ninja- I hate main healing because I'm a Summoner and see this as the job of real WHMs or perhaps an RDM companion. A coupls of shadows means I don't have to cure as much.

2. Palidin- yeah they cure themsevles...I love that!

3. Warrior- got pegged as a DD as of late but a stray one or two can still tank.

(I just can't find any of these people)

Found the problem. Rectify this and you'll do just fine. Also, finding a tank and a few other people who want to form a static is in your best interest. You'll always have people to party with, and can even be a real Summoner at the same time. Barring that, y- Brb, Iraq.

[Shadowneko]

Well I see the same trend too. But I think is harder to find a whm than a tank. Alot of time when I wanna lvl my thf I can find everything except a whm. And that force me to either solo some of my other jobs or just lvl my lower lvl jobs

I can usually find a WHM when I'm playing Summoner or I can gimp heal(which I really don't like doing)....In fact I can find a full party...except for anyone with the ability to tank!

I will take WAR Tanks for sure and if they don't wana tank I'd try to make them. A WAR with the right gear is just as good as a pally ^^(I had a War tank in my "Get THF to 75" static)

[Mouser]

Part of the problem with WAR tanks is that unlike a NIN (who can get away with just DD gear) and a PLD (who can just use tank gear), few WARs invest in tank gear since they are so rarely called upon to tank. Which leads to WARs not being able to tank when asked, which reinforces the idea that WARs can't tank, which leads to WARs not investing in tank gear, which reinforces the whole cycle.

[BurningPanther]

So when people invite a WAR to tank, and the WAR says he doesn't have the gear, just pass him up for then next guy that does have what you're looking for.

Eventually, getting passed up for lack of tank gear will prompt him to get it. And eventually the cycle will diminish.

[eticket109]

The cool thing about FFXI or MMOs in general, is how much the players shape the game. I'm pretty sure that SE looked at PLD and WAR as the two primary tanking jobs initially. Even once NIN was introduced it seemed to be described as more of a DD job then anything else. Heck, now we even have BRDs tanking at endgame. I bet SE never saw that one coming. lol

[Akashimo]

Oh speaking of war and mnk tanks.
Last night, TP burn, brdx2, war/nin x2(with haubys @.@), whm and mnk(me ^^)
So wars got their songs of choice, margril and minuet i believe. Party was ok considering most of the times, wars shadows were pretty much non existant Even while duo tanking. So being the hate stealing monk (normally unintentional) I am, Voke, counterstance (removed it after use from 30 mins of doing this since I forgot my counter-eva gear after noticing counters where normal amounts). Hate stayed steady even with Cure IV and curaga II bombs @.@; Even starting off with 6-8 boost chi blast in mnd gear (yum 280 chi blast) Sets hate ^^; So long story short, by the time I had to log, (15 mins getting party members, 30 to get to camp while waiting on 5th and 6th, 60 mins of exp and 10 mins of waiting for a bard that d/c to repop befor continuing) about 6k total gain, with some steady chain 4 or 5 before letting the whm heal to full mp. Though funniest moment, 24/1378 hp @.@ before wars could barely get hate off xD (with any/all JA they can use + voke). Fun yes, trust wars for DD, not really. Different, totally @.@ moar!

[LyonheartLakshmi]

Oh speaking of war and mnk tanks.
Last night, TP burn, brdx2, war/nin x2(with haubys @.@), whm and mnk(me ^^)
.... wars shadows were pretty much non existant Even while duo tanking...
WAR evasion is crap to begin with, so those shadows probably would have been just as "non-existant" had the WARs not been wearing Haubys. It's quite common for WARs who are dual tanking to wear all out assault gear, rather than tanking gear.
Fun yes, trust wars for DD, not really.
Not quite sure what that last comment is supposed to mean.

[Akashimo]

Not quite sure what that last comment is supposed to mean.
Well, wars in general that I've exped with get less and less impressive for me to like having the class in general for parties, much less lines of tanking. Espically the ones that are most likely leveling the job for the merrit parties. No offense to anyone who serious about the job and want to level it right.

[Karinya]

Sadly, I have to agree. WAR looks like a job with great potential (and I had quite a bit of fun taking it up to 37 - mostly tanking or GA DD, since /nin is weak at those levels), but there are so many half-assed flavor-of-the-month WARs lately, I'm reluctant to invite a WAR I don't know for anything - and definitely not to tank unless they have a /seacom indicating that they are prepared to tank. If that means nobody gets a party because all the wars are lazy slobs, well, I'll just go solo birds.

It's not pretty, but it's the state of the job right now.

P.S. Please don't tank in DD gear, I don't care if you do have Utsusemi. The moment shadows go down you get smacked for 200, if not WS'd for 1000+. And lose hate accordingly. Shadows are a nice addition to good defense, not a substitute for it (especially for jobs with bad evasion!). If you're going to tank, TANK. Conversely, if you're not going to tank, watch your hate unless it's close enough to the end of the fight for your shadows to last until the mob dies. People who aren't going to wear armor have a responsibility to not pull hate they can't deal with.

[Celeal]

I think level 45+ mnk/war has better tanking potential than war/mnk. Holding hate with Counterstance swaping evasion/agi+ gear is very interesting.

Recently I am leveling MNK (as DD), and I use Counterstance all the time in PT. I have macro to swap evasion/agi+ gear whenever pull hate from mob. It works very well for me, I even swap in Crow Jupon (Evasion+8 Enmity-8) with other evasion/agi+ gear while keeping Counterstance up, in order to DD more freely without being a MP-sink.

From my observation, it seems that accuracy and evasion have some impact of how often counter-attack triggers (just my observation, I don't have data to prove it).

In terms of JA for Hate/Tanking, both war/mnk and mnk/war has very similiar tools (the classic Provoke -> Boost -> Boost -> Provoke...). The only difference is war has Aggressor, mnk has Counterstance. In other words, both war/mnk and mnk/war have similiar hate-routine.

For exping VT ~ low IT mob, if the mob is being Slowed/Paralyzed/Blinded, I think it is safe for mnk/war to tank with Counterstance with sushi + evasion set (just gear like a NIN tank in evasion build).

[LyonheartLakshmi]

P.S. Please don't tank in DD gear, I don't care if you do have Utsusemi. The moment shadows go down you get smacked for 200, if not WS'd for 1000+.
That's what gear swap macros are for. Hauby while shadows are up / other WAR has mob's attention. When shadows go down and you still have hate, swap in tank gear.

If a WAR is solo tanking before/without Ni... well, yeah, trying to tank in DD gear is assisted suicide (and exp mobs are very capable assitants). DD gear should only get swapped in for WS, and swapped right back out.

[Lmnop]

I did a pretty decent job @60 before I got my AF body - meaning Haub was the only body piece I had. I remember the DDs sucked in that party though; i'd rather not go into the actual performance of that party. But for my (Bard assisted) part, I think it went smoothly.

Problem with the tank swaps is the "blinking." It's really not that difficult for a mage to press F3 again, but complications can and do arrise.

Somewhere in the 60s I decided the ticket was to double my macros. Basically, I have a macro that puts on all attack/acc accessories and another for defense accessories (these 2 macros won't cause blinking). Then I have 2 more macros for all the slots that do blink. my Defense "blinking" pieces are also my enmity heavy AF, so it doubles as my Enmity set. The idea for this outfit was to be able to wear defense accessories when shadows dropped while tanking and not have to swap out of the pure DD stuff. I've ended up doing it backwards - often tanking with shadows up in my full AF for the enmity+ and dedicating all accessories to DD. It's nice to have this flexibility, but after long periods of not leveling WAR (going on month #4 now), I forget which is which and just mash them all.