Dagger & Sword

[hongman]

No competition here, i know. Both have their uses, dependant on job.

However, Dagger has really started to impress me. I left my Dagger skill at 16 for a loooooong time, till i recently skilled it up to 128.

The WS's are cool, not overly sure about DMG output? They are lower DPS than my swords but it seems to take same amount of time to melee a mob down, plus Cyclone/Gust Slash tends to hit for more than mty sword WS's (only up to Shining BLade)

Just wanted to find out everyone's other preferences vs the 2 thats all.

Im not 100% but I also think my skillups are coming much faster on the Dagger? Iv since overtaken my sword skill, and Sword has been my main all the way through my RDM career.

ALso, whats up with Viper Bite? It sucks!! I know on a crit (like SA) it deals some nice dmg but alone, its really really bad. Or am I missing something?

Just a boredom rant, over now, gonna go grab another coffee. ^^

Oh, and I know its best to keep both at hand, but im talking about if you really really had to choose 1 of them.

[Omni]

most dagger skills until dancing edge are horrible w/o SA. that's just how it is. but given the fact that sata-viperbite is the most damaging ws until 55 with sidewinder/slugshot, i think its ok :p

[Wise Donkey]

Situational uses for each. As you said, it really depends on the job, level, and situation - I couldn't pick just one unless you told me those things.

Lower delay weapons will always skill up faster than higher delay weapons, as you swing more often, thus giving more opportunity to gain skill.

[hongman]

I think the Dagger WS's are quite good tbh, overall.

Or maybe its mob specific. I was skilling up on Doom Scorps in ALtep, and Gust Slash on 200-300% would yield around 260ish dmg, and Cyclone a lil bit more.

Shining Strike/Fast Blade/Burning Blade didnt quite get over 200ish.

Dancing Edge is only a THF iirc :( Maybe Ill have to lvl THF just to use it a few times XD

Its just amazing how a 300% Viper hits for like 60 and then add a Crit to it and you're looking hundreds...

Wise, I know its is very very situational, thats why I tried to generalise it as much as possible by asking "if you had to pick one". Some people will be able to outright say they prefer one over another, whilst some cant/wont. Thats ok though.

[Wise Donkey]

Wise, I know its is very very situational, thats why I tried to generalise it as much as possible

:huh:

[Malacite]

Sword-chucks yo!

[Kirihn]

Yeah, I've only gotten THF to level 25 so far on my mule and for it I've bounced back and forth between sword and dagger skilling both up along the way.

The coolest thing I've noticed so far is that by raising dagger it raises your parry skill more frequently, this is really awesome because with a higher parry skill after raising thf when I raise my mnk or my WAR I parry quite often while tanking.

Also, early on when leveling a job (between 1-10) when you're soloing the higher parry is great because it just adds to your survivabillity.

[Murphie]

Totally situational. As a RDM it depends on what mobs I'm fighting, and what subjob I'm using. I use Dagger a bit more than sword while solo though, I've found. But when/if I get a Joytoy, it would change to sword.

[Mhurron]

Swords look better then daggers when I'm running around.

[Murphie]

Dual shields ftw.

[Taskmage]

If you really recognize that the answer is totally situational depending on your mob targets, subjob, level and camp then you must also realise that any "generalised" answer would be meaningless. It's like asking "Which is better: doors or windows?"

[Murphie]

The clear answer is French Doors, Taskmage.

[Taskmage]

For a house, sure. For my car I would definately have to choose windows, since I could still get in and be able to drive without hanging my head out an open door, but it would be damn inconvenient if I wanted to give any overweight, elderly or handicapped people a ride, not to mention cargo.

Of course, if I had any sense I would demand my car come with doors and windows. Similarly, swords and daggers are both capped on my rdm. :p

[Mhurron]

For a house, sure. For my car I would definately have to choose windows, since I could still get in and be able to drive without hanging my head out an open door, but it would be damn inconvenient if I wanted to give any overweight, elderly or handicapped people a ride, not to mention cargo. You'd get better gas milage if you kept the windows closed and used the AC instead. Doors are the clear winner.

[Taskmage]

Well of course I'd close the windows after I got in. Besides, how aerodynamic would the car be with a big door in the front?

[Mhurron]

Depends on how the door was shaped.

BMW with front door (http://www.bmwworld.com/models/600_aerocar.htm)

[Taskmage]

O.o Fine, doors win. But that doesn't make the "only one or the other" discussion any less silly.

For red mages:

In general, daggers are better DoT for rdms before Joyeuse because their lower delay increases the number of times Enspell fires, thus directly increasing your damage. Joyeuse's double attack makes it faster than any dagger except Beestinger, Platoon Dagger and Hornetneedle, which all have lower base damage. Against magic-resistant mobs, swords become better in general, since their total damage is weighted more towards physical and is reduced less.

For weaponskills dagger has a better toolbox, with a int-based WS in AoE and non AoE flavors, an mp-drain WS, and eventually a strong physical WS with Evisceration, which opens/closes Darkness. All are available without a special subjob. Sword on the other hand has the invaluable Spirits Within, and at 100% TP Vorpal Blade from /drk /pld /war or /blu is comparable to Evisceration. All sword weaponskills can close level 2 chains. Savage Blade opens/closes Light.

All daggers do piercing damage, and will thus do more damage to flying mobs and mandies than a slashing-type sword with the same damage rating, but less to skeletons and hounds. However there are both piercing-type swords and slashing-type swords, making them superior as a category from a standpoint of damage type flexibility.

Of course, depending on your level the quality of weapon selection on each side of the comparison varies widely.


For thieves:

Swords are better mainhand weapons until 100 skill at level 33, since two-hit SA Fast Blade owns one-hit SA Wasp Sting, and no other weaponskills at that point gain any benefit from SA (ignoring the option of h2h with /mnk). After that, physical dagger WS stay firmly ahead of their sword counterparts, and sword skill rating drops off.

[Murphie]

As a Taru, I find my Cyclones still do more damage than Spirits Within, which is sad, but not unexpected. :(

[Mhurron]

O.o Fine, doors win. But that doesn't make the "only one or the other" discussion any less silly.Actually I believe it makes the thread very silly.
Anyway
For red mages:
Taskmage said some great stuff, look up to read it.
Bottom line is, swords look better. As far as using weapons you should have both available by the time you go out swinging one. This will probably mean helping a lot with AF coffers and skillup parties.

[Mhurron]

As a Taru, I find my Cyclones still do more damage than Spirits Within, which is sad, but not unexpected. :(
Spirits Within doesn't do much unless you wait until a full 300% TP. I don't use a dagger much so I can't off the top of my head remember what a 300% TP cyclone does.

[Murphie]

Yeah, I mean with 300% TP. :( I just don't have a huge HP pool.

[Mhurron]

Yeah, I mean with 300% TP. :( I just don't have a huge HP pool.
I've never been that sad with Spirits Within. But then I've never expected my melee output to be any good since I have no gear geared towards that.

[Murphie]

Well, it doesn't make me sad, per se. It's just that I get better results generally with my dagger WS. I still use my sword, but it's just not as impressive.

Not that I expected anything all that impressive in the first place.

[Raydeus]

Depends on your lvl of course but a 300 TP Cyclone does 450+ dmg to all mobs, while a taru RDM wont go beyond the 350-375 mark with SW (15/32 of your current HP) unless they wear a ton of +HP gear.

And Evisceration will pwn both easily when you get it. :biggrin:

[Murphie]

Yeah, I get somewhere in the mid-300s generally.

[hongman]

Ok, while it still somehow makes sense to me what I'm asking, it doesnt to you but the answers (even the windows vs doors) have been more than I expected.

The comparison Taskmage made was spot on. Thanks!

[Humar]

I go with daggers cause i just like to attack more often and now that im a THF at 33 i can SATAVB in parties(assuming the tank DOESNT FLIPPIN MOVE ON ME AFTER VOKING!!)
but none the less i have both Sword and Dagger capped and im moderatly trained in H2H as well.....

[Karinya]

What makes SATAVB good isn't the fact that it's a crit, it's the bonus to DMG from THF main SA and TA (based on dex and agi).

If you try SATAVB as a RDM60/THF30, it still sucks, because you're getting the crit but not the +DMG.

Daggers get more hits and more enspell damage compared to normal swords, but not compared to Joyeuse or Justice Sword. Too bad there isn't a virtue dagger...

P.S. Does anyone know if Martial Knife gets more MP from Energy Steal/Drain? Enough to make it worth using despite its otherwise poor stats?

[hongman]

Another thing I thought of is whilst using a dagger attacks quicker so therefore gives the mob more TP quickly - so if the mob has a nasty TP Move, I'm sticking to Sword :)

[Armando]

Mob TP gain speed shouldn't have any significant weight when choosing a weapon. It just doesn't make a difference most of the time.

[Raydeus]

P.S. Does anyone know if Martial Knife gets more MP from Energy Steal/Drain? Enough to make it worth using despite its otherwise poor stats?

It does because it counts the WS +100 TP, so the same amount of MP drained at 200TP with any other dagger is the amount of MP you get at 100TP with Martial.

Same goes for WS like Moonlight (Club).

[Taskmage]

Mob TP gain speed shouldn't have any significant weight when choosing a weapon. It just doesn't make a difference most of the time.In a party I'd agree with you entirely, but in solo or duo where a rdm can actually get away with melee, it can make a significant difference. Still not a major consideration but not an entirely negligable one either.

[TenchiHawkwing]

If you're soloing RDM with a wannabe DD setup just for fun I'd say Dagger & Sword, not one or the other. Mainhand dagger for Evisceration and offhand Joyeuse for it's DPS & TP gain. Throw on an enspell and goto work spamming Evis.

It's damn fun, I'll have to level RDM on my own character so I can do that when I'm not at my cousin's house. You can destroy EP/DC mobs like that and take EM/Ts down with minimal effort even with their TP moves comin' at you.

I definitely wouldn't say it was the most effective way of doing much of anything... it was just fun. But being a PLD main, my vote is going for Sword.

[Shinhiryu_Kage]

I tend to think that Hornetneedle & Martial Knife are just about the best weapons in the game overall for a RDM. With Joytoy being a very close and personal running 2nd. Havent' fooled with E.Sword but yeah lolz.

My Taru RDM friend could pull off 4-500 Cyclones on a T w/Martial Knfie and w/a full int+mab setup and easily 24ish dmg from -En spells per hit with the right gear. He also had /nin and supponomimi. I was really impressed lol, so I switched to it on my mithra (last character.) He and I use to duo the buffalo for xp merit up on Bearclaw Pinnacle and we could do 3k per hour just by ourselves lol. It was rather novel.

With daggers, if the mob happens to be an MP user and you're in an emergency, you could quickly gett of an Energy Drain for some nice phat litte mp. That's a bonus.

Evisceration is cool against TW to EP mobs, but I didn't like it for anything more than that. Cyclone seems to almost ignore this however and works the same regardless.

[Armando]

How do you figure Hornetneedle is better than Joyeuse? Joyeuse hits as often as a Hornetneedle with more than twice the DMG/sec.

[hongman]

If i have 1 hand dagger and offhand Sword...

1) does this reduce the delay vs sword + sword?
2) can i skillup on both?

Currently wielding Dst. baselard and WWA.

[Shadowneko]

I think the Dagger WS's are quite good tbh, overall.

Or maybe its mob specific. I was skilling up on Doom Scorps in ALtep, and Gust Slash on 200-300% would yield around 260ish dmg, and Cyclone a lil bit more.

Shining Strike/Fast Blade/Burning Blade didnt quite get over 200ish.

Dancing Edge is only a THF iirc :( Maybe Ill have to lvl THF just to use it a few times XD

Its just amazing how a 300% Viper hits for like 60 and then add a Crit to it and you're looking hundreds...

Wise, I know its is very very situational, thats why I tried to generalise it as much as possible by asking "if you had to pick one". Some people will be able to outright say they prefer one over another, whilst some cant/wont. Thats ok though.

Cyclone is an AoE tho and it's really dangerous in parties! I never used it except when farming...

[hongman]

Cyclone is an AoE tho and it's really dangerous in parties! I never used it except when farming...

I know when I can use AoE's and when I cant/shouldnt :thumbsup:

[Shinhiryu_Kage]

How do you figure Hornetneedle is better than Joyeuse? Joyeuse hits as often as a Hornetneedle with more than twice the DMG/sec.

I owned a Joyeuse on my prev character before it was cancelled. I never found any difference in terms of speed of killing vs the two weapons, except, for the fact that I could perform stronger WS dmg w/Cyclone than I could w/Joyeuse.

The sword looks pretty, its a huge effort to get (in a sense).... I didn't think it was that great of an improvement over what I had already been working w/in solo play for quite a while. I was actually unimpressed and somewhat let down.

Now, I never sat down and calculated a bunch of nerdy math about it. If you happen to do that and show its better, then that would be awesome and I'll be believer that its the "zomgwtfbbqsw0rdofthagodz." lol

However, now that I think about it, I did say overall. Did you miss that part?

[LyonheartLakshmi]

If i have 1 hand dagger and offhand Sword...

1) does this reduce the delay vs sword + sword?
2) can i skillup on both?

Currently wielding Dst. baselard and WWA.
1) Your overall delay when dual wielding is calculated by averaging the delay of both weapons. So a dagger/sword setup will have less delay than a sword/sword setup.
2) Yes, you can skill up both weapons at the same time.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

How do you figure Hornetneedle is better than Joyeuse? Joyeuse hits as often as a Hornetneedle with more than twice the DMG/sec.
Perhaps Hornetneedle isn't as good as Joyeuse, but it's definitely more accessible.

[Taskmage]

Joyeuse is better than Hornetneedle in every concievable way.
It hits harder. Joyeuse has a damage rating of 35 vs Hornetneedle's 16.
It hits faster. Hornetneedle has a delay of 150. Joyeuse has a delay of 224 but double attacks half the time. Three attacks in two rounds is equivalent to each hit having 149.33 delay.
It gains TP faster. Even though Joyeuse's effective delay is slightly lower than Hornetneedle's, it still gains TP per hit based on its listed delay of 224, so Joyeuse gets 6.1 TP per hit while Hornetneedle gets only 5. When Joyeuse hits 300% TP a Hornetneedle would only be at 250%. In the time it takes for Hornetneedle to charge a 500+ damage 300 tp Cyclone, a Joyeuse could've done three 220+ damage 100 tp Savage Blade or better yet four 350+ damage 100 tp Vorpal Blades, since each of those WSes pushes the sword farther ahead in TP.Hornetneedle was my pride and joy for 27 levels, but "overall" it doesn't hold a candle to Joytoy.

[Konie]

hmm dagger gets my vote, thf main so umm yea, sword is nice but it doesnt have a single spectacular WS (although it has allot of solid ws's) daggers are just cool too

i used to have a kitty named dagger... and princess garnet in ffix calls herself dagger

so for this kitten daggers rule!!!

p.s. biggest dilema of my life was dager or sword merits x.x i swear it was worse then dark chocolate or milk chocolate (chocolate won)

[forevergamer]

sword for me.but off course,it still depends on the job you have.personally,i'd go for the sword.much cooler to wave around.:biggrin:

Keep playing!!I do!!

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Sword if its for honor.
Dagger if its personal :evil:

[Kyrial Arthian]

Its just amazing how a 300% Viper hits for like 60 and then add a Crit to it and you're looking hundreds...
Several misconceptions here. First, TP doesn't affect damage on Viper Bite; only the duration of the poison effect. Second, the reason SA (or SATA) Viper Bite does so much damage for a THF is because Sneak Attack doesn't *just* make an attack a crit for a THF main; it also adds your DEX score to your main hand weapon's DMG score. And Trick Attack adds your AGI score to it too (again, THF main onry), so that's why the damage on SATA Viper Bite goes so comparitively high. Even if a RDM/THF with the same dagger skill as a THF did a SA+VB on the same mob, it would do a lot less damage, simply because SA isn't adding the RDM's DEX to their weapon's DMG score.

EDIT: Bleh, it looked like there was only one page before I posted this, but apparently there were 2 more... too lazy to go see if someone else addressed this; I'm sure someone did. Ah well. :P

[hongman]

Thanks Kyrial, didnt know all the facts about VB. I do now ^^

[Renaissance 2K]

Anybody who has ever read 8-Bit Theater is going to choose "Swords".

[Shinhiryu_Kage]

Joyeuse is better than Hornetneedle in every concievable way.

It hits harder. Joyeuse has a damage rating of 35 vs Hornetneedle's 16.
It hits faster. Hornetneedle has a delay of 150. Joyeuse has a delay of 224 but double attacks half the time. Three attacks in two rounds is equivalent to each hit having 149.33 delay.
It gains TP faster. Even though Joyeuse's effective delay is slightly lower than Hornetneedle's, it still gains TP per hit based on its listed delay of 224, so Joyeuse gets 6.1 TP per hit while Hornetneedle gets only 5. When Joyeuse hits 300% TP a Hornetneedle would only be at 250%. In the time it takes for Hornetneedle to charge a 500+ damage 300 tp Cyclone, a Joyeuse could've done three 220+ damage 100 tp Savage Blade or better yet four 350+ damage 100 tp Vorpal Blades, since each of those WSes pushes the sword farther ahead in TP.Hornetneedle was my pride and joy for 27 levels, but "overall" it doesn't hold a candle to Joytoy.

Ah, now I see why I didn't notice a difference. Without parsing, the differences are almost negligible. While you are correct, "overall" I disagree that Joyeuse is absolutely wonderful for what it does. Joyeus is nice. It's good. Its just *not* wonderfully great compared to Hornetneedle. Sorry to say that about the sword everyone wants. I just don't see it that way. I can agree w/the magic defense mobs. I don't remember fighting too *terribly* many of those. The piercing aspect of Joyeuse is quite nice though and I never knew that.

On a side note, its possible to push up the damage of Cyclone in a way with your equipment and still keep MP and things, and at 300TP, you can do way more than 500 dmg w/cyclone. My taru friend, for example, has pulled off 700-800 Cyclones, just in equipment alone, at 300 tp. But, you say Vorpal Blade can in effect do 1200+ damage in the time Cyclone could (which I've seen it do 700-800 dmg.) Are we talking vs EM and greater? Because I am. Sword damage is based on your att, etc. Cyclone is not. Will you do 1200+ damage from WS against EM+? I fail to see that, but if you say so, OK.

IMO, Energy Drain is vastly useful in certain situations. Sword skills do not supply this. Again, the concept of "overall" seems to favor HN IMO.

However, I'd still keep both weapons. They both have their uses, that was never a question for me. I just don't see spending gregorious amounts of time to obtain JT as worth the cost for what it does. But, c'est la vie.

In your defense, I'm playing a Galka RDM right now. With full HP and 300 TP, I can pull off 1263 SW. This is at LV70 and still have 5 more levels to go. If I messed around w/my equipment, I could possibly pull off really interesting SW's. "Now," I can forsee some great interesting differences w/my Galka about sword vs dagger. I'll just have to wait it out and get to that point. W/my Galka, it may be way more beneficial for me to go w/JT vs HN. My previous char was a Mithra.

[hongman]

I still havent got any of them yet....I am taking yet another (possibly failed) break at RDM to get my subs up and a few quests done, inluding HornetNeedle and if the situation permits, Joytoy.

[Taskmage]

I dunno, Shinhiryu. I'll try out both weapons on steelshells and korrigans sometime and get some hard numbers, cyclone with as much INT and MAB as I can get and vorpal boosted normally. I tend to do most of my meleeing vs coffer key level mobs, so that's what my estimates are based on. I'll give you one thing though, not being a dagger is the one big problem with Joyuese from a rdm perspective. I'd trade Gust Slash, Cyclone, Energy Drain and Evisceration for RLB, SW, Vorpal and Savage Blade in most situations.

Point for point stuff:

I don't see how you can say that a difference of 16 dmg and 35 dmg on weapons with effectively the same delay is "almost negligible." That would be like a warrior using a level 1 axe in Qufim and not seeing any difference.

For mobs with innate magic defense bonus, the only mobs I can think of off the top of my head are demons and ahriman. I fight these relatively often to help friends with keys or tests, or to pick up a little quick cash or level my NPC. If you don't usually fight these, I understand entirely and that makes the MDB point rather moot. I think, though, that imps have innate magic damage reduction too, which might be slightly more relevant.

[Celeal]

P.S. Does anyone know if Martial Knife gets more MP from Energy Steal/Drain? Enough to make it worth using despite its otherwise poor stats?

I have a question~ Does Energy Steal/Drain works on non-mp mobs? I have never seen Energy Steal/Drain in action ^^;

[Hyrist]

No, if the mob does not have MP, Energy Steal/Drain does nothing.

I prefer a sword mainly. This is just because I also level Blue mage and am serioulsly thinking about leveling Paladin as well (once I have a few meirts under my belt.)

However there are many many uses for dagger that I don't give up on. I do my best to keep both capped at all times.

[Shinhiryu_Kage]

I dunno, Shinhiryu. I'll try out both weapons on steelshells and korrigans sometime and get some hard numbers, cyclone with as much INT and MAB as I can get and vorpal boosted normally. I tend to do most of my meleeing vs coffer key level mobs, so that's what my estimates are based on. I'll give you one thing though, not being a dagger is the one big problem with Joyuese from a rdm perspective. I'd trade Gust Slash, Cyclone, Energy Drain and Evisceration for RLB, SW, Vorpal and Savage Blade in most situations.

Point for point stuff:

I don't see how you can say that a difference of 16 dmg and 35 dmg on weapons with effectively the same delay is "almost negligible." That would be like a warrior using a level 1 axe in Qufim and not seeing any difference.

For mobs with innate magic defense bonus, the only mobs I can think of off the top of my head are demons and ahriman. I fight these relatively often to help friends with keys or tests, or to pick up a little quick cash or level my NPC. If you don't usually fight these, I understand entirely and that makes the MDB point rather moot. I think, though, that imps have innate magic damage reduction too, which might be slightly more relevant.

I'm sorry. At the time when I had it, I wasn't educated that the proc-rate for JT was 50%. I think I read that somewhere else recently, so I am updated. I was eyeballing figures, and it appeared to me that it wasn't that great of an enhancement. Wasn't taking into account that JT was hitting just as fast as HN (if not a second faster) and for twice the damage.

Sitting down and reading verbatim, I see how JT actually is quite better than HN. So, I retract some of my statements. /bow

[BurningPanther]

I have both Sword and Dagger capped at 250. I <3 my Joyeuse and my Hornetneedle, but I <3 my Joyeuse so much more(might have something to do with the trouble I went through to get it). Those two are like a "My Buddy." Wherever I go, they go!

All in all, I'm partial to swords, because no matter how useful a dagger can be, swords just look so much cooler to me. As such, it'll be my Sword skill that I give max merits to.



QUESTION: Guespiere: Keep it, or sell it?

[Taskmage]

If you generally only melee in solo and you already have a Joyeuse, I'd say sell the Guespiere. Joytoy pumps out more damage, and Guespiere's additional effect won't go off while you have En-spell on. If you get to melee in small groups like an exp duo or get opportunities to play the melee/support role, I'd hold on to the Guespiere a while and see how it works out.

[BurningPanther]

If you generally only melee in solo and you already have a Joyeuse, I'd say sell the Guespiere. Joytoy pumps out more damage, and Guespiere's additional effect won't go off while you have En-spell on. If you get to melee in small groups like an exp duo or get opportunities to play the melee/support role, I'd hold on to the Guespiere a while and see how it works out.
Yeah, I did scrape together for the Guespiere before I had my Joyeuse, and I notice that, in addition to the Def. down effect not working in conjunction with En-spells, it's proc rate is almost nonexistent against anything higher than DC. I used to keep it onhand for Savage Blade STR and MND mod, but I've seen the light and take more to Spirits Within nowadays. I guess I'll sell it after all.
New question: Misericorde +1: Keep or sell?

[Taskmage]

Sell it and if you miss having it, put the money toward a Blau Dolch.

Personally, I keep Garuda's Dagger, Hornetneedle and Misericorde around, but I never ever use them anymore now that I have Joytoy. I like dagger ws better unless I'm skillchaining with my npc, but it's hard to argue with the superior DoT and TP gain from Joyeuse. Imo, Blau is the only dagger available to rdms that has a shot at competing with Joy, so that's what it would take to get me to use daggers again. I'll see if I can borrow my friend's and test Blau vs Joy on Boyahda mobs instead of Hornetneedle, now that Shinhiryu's conceded on that point.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

I do have to side with Joyeuse. When I do get a chance to melee as COR in merit PT Joyeuse + Gun make for some serious TP gain toward Slug Shots. Now I want a Kraken Club for my RNG. My RNG is jealous of my COR and will not stand for this.

[Armando]

If I'm not mistaken, Joyeuse has the highest DMG/sec on a one-handed weapon aside from Ridill, relic weapons and virtue weapons (w/ stones) and on top of that it gains TP roughly 50% faster than a normal weapon. Blau Dolch is definetely powerful, but I think Joyeuse will win out unless Evisceration does a lot more damage than Vorpal Blade (which I doubt.) Still, I'm interested in seeing the results.

[Yellow Mage]

Anybody who has ever read 8-Bit Theater is going to choose "Swords".

Naw, Sword-CHUCKS are where it's at :thumbsup: .

I wonder if S-E would actually make something like that . . .

:rofl: