Pissed off about COR

[Duelist0851]

Firstly I'm a COR54. I orignally started playing COR because I find PT enhancing jobs fun and I thought the AF would look really badass! Never before have I played a job that costed so much to help other people... But it's a ranged attack job, and ranged attack jobs need ammo.. expensive ammo... I get that. (And don't get me started on the crappy selection of COR ammo..) But now we have to pay for stupid materials just to get our AF!? So not only is our ammo more expensive than RNG's.. and does less dmg.. But we have to pay for our 'free' things too...? When the hell does this job ever catch a break? I've done alot of AF quests in the past... one major bonus of AF was that IT WAS FREE EQUIP!!! I am very frustrated with this job and thinking of hanging it up. Would the cost of taking COR to 75 even be worth it? Thinking of hanging up the towel before I waste any more of my time and gil.

[Mhurron]

Now wait a minute, is this what you're babbleing about:
He wants the following 4 items and 1 IP coin
Gold Chain
Velvet Cloth
Red Grass Cloth
Sail Cloth

[PTT]

You're not alone. Puppetmaster has to make their non-quested AF too, and I assume that goes the same for BLU (Yes? No?).

It could be worse though. Ninja live through their gil. Some people say the skill "Gil Toss" isn't in the game, but I think Ninja got it this time around, instead of Samurai... if you get my drift.

[Silkiv]

Right now Cor Body and feet are each about 500k each to make, which is a bit much.. Think we Cor’s have it bad? Blu crafted armor each uses a 3m Imperial silk Cloth.. yeah 10M for full Blu Af. 1.5M for Cor AF isn’t as bad but still is rough

It’s just bad now since people are price gouging the new players, by doubling or tripling the price of some of these materials. Hopefully it will get better in a few months.

[Amovorite]

Makes me glad that I had two Gold Chains for the eventual Tortoise Earrings +1 that I eventually wanted to attempt to make. Yeah... having to buy materials to craft the AF is kind of a bummer. To a degree, I'd rather have gone coffer hunting... but to that... could you imagine your competition in coffer hunting for the next several months?

[Balfree]

Farm the materials?

[Dayala]

Farm the materials?

Quoted for the obvious answer! I'm farming my stuff, don't care if it takes me a month and crafters in my LS gonna make my items for me with <3's. Just get a skill up pt together for the harder items and just go get 'em.

[Balfree]

lol that sounds like sarcasm XD...

but really, would you prefer having to compete with 3252346246252562365234528502642137823078956238752 other players for your key + coffer?

be glad all it takes is gil..

[Sirius]

Good news for me, last time I checked I had gil out the ass... Unless they deleted my character. SE doesn't seem to want to answer me, as always.

[Murphie]

lol that sounds like sarcasm XD...

but really, would you prefer having to compete with 3252346246252562365234528502642137823078956238752 other players for your key + coffer?

be glad all it takes is gil..Exactly. Folks, the obvious answer if you don't want to be gouged on the prices is to farm the materials yourself or just wait to do your AF until everyone who is rushing to do it now is done.

I would much rather pay some gil and/or farm materials than have to fight with every other COR on my server for a key and a coffer.

Someone was also complaining in game yesterday about how some of the NMs you fight are poppable. I asked if they would prefer to have to fight every other person playing that job for a random claim or just stand in line and wait their turn.

I mean, seriously.

In a few months, the materials aren't going to be nearly as expensive as they are right now. So suck it up, or just wait.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

The problem is that no other jobs, save for the new ones, are forced to do AFs in this fashion. Can we say "unbalanced?"

Yeah, almost every line of AF quests has one crafted item for it, but its just ONE. I'm sure that was exploited back in the day, too, but we're talking a day and night difference between Zilart AF quests and the ToA ones. BLU, COR and PUP are asked to get multiple items for multiple quests.

What would have been so difficult about putting the coffers in pre-ToA areas? I'd rather deal with this so-called "competition" for coffers than be forced to farm or wait for the AH to cool of so I can get my AF. There are plenty of places to put these quests, hell, the CoPs zones go largely unused for this purpose, why not put some in those?

I'm flabbergasted that anyone would even defend poorly-designed quests. People who are playing the new jobs are totally in the right to complain about these quests that replace the standard coffer hunt. There were several different and better ways SE could have done this and still made it challenging and everyone knows it. This was just poor, lazy design and RMTs and greedy players will exploit the hell out ot it for as long as they can.

I'll farm it, but I won't like it and SE is going to get an earfull. I hope that for future CORs they fix these quests to something a tad more reasonable. Right now, only the rich or supremely patient player... or just RMT-fed noobs can do these AFs. Everyone should be able to do them, period.

[Murphie]

What would have been so difficult about putting the coffers in pre-ToA areas? I'd rather deal with this so-called "competition" for coffers than be forced to farm or wait for the AH to cool of so I can get my AF. There are plenty of places to put these quests, hell, the CoPs zones go largely unused for this purpose, why not put some in those?The "competition" that you mention (and why the quotes, exactly?) is the reason that the prices are so high in the first place. If you had to compete against every COR BLU or PUP on your server for a key dropping mob or a coffer, you wouldn't be any happier than you are right now. At least with the system currently in place you don't have to scour a zone looking for a treasure coffer that everyone else in the world is also looking for. I can't believe that anyone would honestly prefer that.

I'm flabbergasted that anyone would even defend poorly-designed quests. People who are playing the new jobs are totally in the right to complain about these quests that replace the standard coffer hunt. There were several different and better ways SE could have done this and still made it challenging and everyone knows it. This was just poor, lazy design and RMTs and greedy players will exploit the hell out ot it for as long as they can.I'll defend them cheerfully. They aren't poorly designed at all. In six months or a year from now people will be able to do these quests with no problems whatsoever. The only problem right now (as is the problem with any new content) is that the number of people wanting to do it are far greater than the supply of necessary items.

I would, however, love to hear your thoughts on all the other really great ways that SE could have done this. Since you claim that everyone knows that there are better ways, and yet I can't think of any, I'd enjoy being clued in on what "everyone" thinks about this.

I'll farm it, but I won't like it and SE is going to get an earfull. I hope that for future CORs they fix these quests to something a tad more reasonable. Right now, only the rich or supremely patient player... or just RMT-fed noobs can do these AFs. Everyone should be able to do them, period.Everyone CAN do them. The problem is that if you're not willing to be patient, you have a lot of competition. The fact is, you don't NEED your AF right this second. But if you want to get it, then you have to pay or spend the time farming. That's the trade off.

[Mhurron]

The problem is that no other jobs, save for the new ones, are forced to do AFs in this fashion. Can we say "unbalanced?"Can you say "SE said AF quests for the new jobs would be different." I knew you could.

Doing something differently is not unbalanced.

[Murphie]

Considering that all of the new jobs were able to level to 75 without the AF proves that you don't even need it, so that shoots the idea of any imbalance in the foot right off.

Maybe people would be happier if SE had just sent a full set of COR BLU and PUP AF to them via the delivery system.

[Mhurron]

Maybe people would be happier if SE had just sent a full set of COR BLU and PUP AF to them via the delivery system.Yep, if you had to do anything people were going to complain about it.

[tdh]

Maybe people would be happier if SE had just sent a full set of COR BLU and PUP AF to them via the delivery system.Can you send me SAM's AF too? I don't think I wanna do all that work. /sigh :evil:

I actually saw a COR in full AF near the AH in Whitegate last night and was surprised.

This problem comes down to greed right now. When Diabolos was released, Poison Potions were selling for 80k to 90k for about 6 days. Then the price bottomed out.

When ToAU was released, Silent Oils almost tripled in price because people needed a way to get to PUP and COR flag quests.

New update let's us have the option for a 60 slot Mog Locker. Imp. Gold pieces went up to 150k EACH at one point, they have now settled around 80k to 90k. Two weeks ago I saw some in a Bazaar for 45k. Absorb-TP costs 27k from a NPC right around the corner from the AH, but people were spending 80k for the scroll. Raptor Mazurka was 4.4k, and was selling for 60k at the AH. People are greedy, and the other people are lazy or in a hurry.

Wait a week or two, and hit the AH up, or just go farm the pieces as a number of people have already mentioned. And while you're waiting, think about a few things.

1) 300+ people are fighting the same mobs to get a Coffer key. As soon a mob pops, it's dead. You could go quite a while with out a single claim.
2) Same 300+ people managed to get a key and are now searching for the Coffer. So you have people trying to get the coffer first when we may not even have an idea where the various spawns are yet. "Lather. Rinse. Repeat." Times 3!!

So would you rather wait another two or three weeks and buy the items for a resasonable price, suck it up and spend the gil to buy the items now, or go back to the old system that would take it MUCH longer for those 300+ people to get their Coffers? People want new content and new challenges, but I guess they don't want to have to work for them at all. /sigh

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

I would, however, love to hear your thoughts on all the other really great ways that SE could have done this. Since you claim that everyone knows that there are better ways, and yet I can't think of any, I'd enjoy being clued in on what "everyone" thinks about this.

Gladly.

First off, a recurring theme of the COR quests is that CORs are slightly more daring than other adventurers. After all, I did have to prance past two true sight mobs to get my AF1 CS, not to mention either avoid or hope merit PTs were clearing Caedarva Mire of Imps on the way to Arropono reef. These are high level zones, with things that could one-shot a 40 with ease or even drop a level 75 fast.

There are plenty of other zones you could viably take such risks in, scattered all over the world. Possibly entailing an NM fight or just a ??? that's very difficult to get to.

Goblins love gambling, we gamble, why not take a gamble with them? Check ENM60 Pulling the Strings, Oldton Movapolos, or the THF AF story line for this. Could entail an NM fight or it could be real gambling. Put up your gil on Phantom Roll against a Goblin COR.

What about the pirates of Norg? What about the Norg pirates that raid the ship to Selbina? The COR storyline seemed to suggest there were different pirate factions, such as the ones of Bastore, Norg pirates seem to have ties with the Far East. What does Gilgamesh know of the Corsairs and their conflict with the Empire? He's a pirate, after all. The cheiftainess of Kazham also was a pirate for a time, serving under Gilgamesh, what would she know?

Buried Treasure... excavation... pickaxes. What about that? AF1 quest gave you some choices where to look, why not dig up some treasure from other areas that might help Qutada and the crew out? Might lead to an NM fight, might not.

I was hoping for some genuine thrills and challenges from the AF quests, much like doing the inital job quest and AF1... not farming and getting gouged at the AH.

[Mhurron]

I have just one thing to say to that:

The problem is that no other jobs ... are forced to do AFs in this fashion. Can we say "unbalanced?"You're suggestions are just as different from existing AF quests as the new ones are.

[Drive]

I actually just wish they had more AF quests. I much rather do AF6 then these items that I luckly got for free/cheap because I know that this is crazy. But my main problem about all this is the imperial silk cloth. People are trying to find what it is to make it because as of now we only know the way to desynth soulflayer's robes to get it and the chance of a break is very high. Not to mention that soulflayers are level 80+ mobs.....I mean they are IT+ at 75 and have some of the nastiest AoE's and spells for a exp mob. I hope there is another way to make this silk since it is only used in three items and two of them being Blu AF other being a imperial tapestry. I don't want to see new players have to go through that trouble especially since I avoided it.

Murphie weren't you one to say you hate having people help you but you aren't of use? think about the these people and their AF when they either feed tp or miss for hours against these Soulflayer's.

[Murphie]

And what about when they do other jobs and can't fight the coffer key mobs or the NMs on their own? It's the same thing. If I hadn't brought a bunch of 75s to do my WHM AF3 I would have been one dead White Mage. That's just the way AF fights go.

I can't help it that SE made the Soulflayers so strong. Isn't that enough challenge for folks? I mean, what is the complaint here? Too challenging? Not challenging enough? What?

[Oogami]

Reason: Most people love to complain.

Even if the AF set were really sent to their Mog House, I am sure that *some* will complain about it. And the a lot of them who "did their AF the old way" would definitely complain about "how unfair it is". (Just like some idiots who demand that they be compensated for all the XP they lost from getting the old Raise 1)

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

You're suggestions are just as different from existing AF quests as the new ones are.

I was asked to give suggestions, I was not asked to make the ideas vastly different. It was on SE to devise the new method, they failed.

And I don't see any better ideas from you.

[Murphie]

The rest of us don't agree that SE's solution is a failure, so we're under no obligation to suggest an alternative method.

[Mhurron]

I was asked to give suggestions, I was not asked to make the ideas vastly different. It was on SE to devise the new method, they failed.

And I don't see any better ideas from you.Since your initial problem was the fact that having differences between the new AF quests and the old ones was that they were different and therefore unbalanced, your suggestions would fail by your own complaints if they were not essentially the same as the old.

Or were you just complaining that they took gil? Well then by that definition NIN and RNG are horribly unbalanced. Oh and most melee jobs. In fact, just about everything in the game requires gil, there must be no balance at all.

I like differences. I think it would have been great if the other 15 jobs didn't do the same 4 quests, 2 coffers for AF.

[Kirsteena]

Hey guys remember when Astral Rings were in a coffer in Castle O? Yeah, most rdm, bards and whatever other job had AF there do. Try getting a coffer there when every damn thf in the server was out to pick the locks.

Its not ideal, and just as it was when pup started, people are price gouging the market. Good thing is, that most of the AF is a bit meh, and you can get to 75 easily without it. You may have to wait a bit for prices to drop, but you will get it. My tabard (you know, +15 enfeebling skill) was Castle O.

[nazlfrag]

Goblins love gambling, we gamble, why not take a gamble with them? Check ENM60 Pulling the Strings, Oldton Movapolos, or the THF AF story line for this. Could entail an NM fight or it could be real gambling. Put up your gil on Phantom Roll against a Goblin COR.
Instead of spending gil (or farming!) items, you will spend gil on gambling to get your AF? How is this different? Fair enough about pirates of Khazam and Norg, but corsairs are based in Aht Urghan. They already have a storyline and cutscenes for their AF. How this would replace a coffer hunt, or the existing method? Going to talk to an NPC is hardly a challenge on par. Grabbing pickaxes and hitting excavation points isn't much better. Fighting NM's is hardly different to fighting mobs that drop the items.
I was hoping for some genuine thrills and challenges from the AF quests, much like doing the inital job quest and AF1... not farming and getting gouged at the AH.
One or the other please. You are farming the items or getting gouged, not both, it's your choice. As said, you can wait for prices to settle or comprimise and pay more if you want it immediately.
SE needed a method for thousands of players to get the same items in a short period of time without inconveniencing everyone. I give them a 10/10 for doing it well.
(Just like some idiots who demand that they be compensated for all the XP they lost from getting the old Raise 1)
Thanks for giving me a laugh... or should I be crying? The depths of idiocy people will sink to astounds me.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Hey guys remember when Astral Rings were in a coffer in Castle O? Yeah, most rdm, bards and whatever other job had AF there do. Try getting a coffer there when every damn thf in the server was out to pick the locks.

And how soon people forget about that. Quoted for truth.

Instead of spending gil (or farming!) items, you will spend gil on gambling to get your AF? How is this different? Fair enough about pirates of Khazam and Norg, but corsairs are based in Aht Urghan. They already have a storyline and cutscenes for their AF. How this would replace a coffer hunt, or the existing method? Going to talk to an NPC is hardly a challenge on par. Grabbing pickaxes and hitting excavation points isn't much better. Fighting NM's is hardly different to fighting mobs that drop the items.

Again, since reading comprehension here seems to be low and people are just now arguing because (1) they don't play these jobs or (2) just like to hear themselves talk, it would be a waste of time for me to ask you to use your imagination as well.

I've stated there was existing pirate lore, places you could excavation treasure/materials, that gambling is common amoung goblins, that NM fights could be included as well. You can't see some of this stuff tied together into actual quests? You've got to be kidding me.

The rest of us don't agree that SE's solution is a failure, so we're under no obligation to suggest an alternative method.

Yeah, you're just here to complain about the complaining.

[Murphie]

And what exactly are you doing, other than doing your own round of complaining? Oh, you're also slinging personal attacks. Kudos!

Several folks (myself included) have explained why we're fine with the system currently in place. If you have a problem with it, that's certainly valid, but that doesn't mean that we're all morons because we don't agree with you.

[SonikU4ia]

In all honesty, I feel slightly dissapointed that there wasn't more "creativity" invovled aside from the AF1 quests for the 3 new jobs.

If you ask me, buying your item seems cheap and blatantly lazy on SE's part. But this is just speculation. I bet they have a good reason for it.

It's quite obvious though, that putting coffers in these new HL areas would have been a bane to the situation. Instead of this thread reading "Pissed off about Cor," it would have read "OMGWTF SE must be nutz COFFERS in 50+ LV zones?????"

However, the intense lack of maturity on behalf of someone who will remain nameless is rather blantantly uncalled for and proving to expose true motives of "emo much?" w

[Skeepz]

How much does cor cost you think per party

[Esoa]

Maybe I should complain that the new jobs get it easier. After all, I could easily farm 500k in the time it took me to organize a party and farm a coffer key.

[Spider-Dan]

Umm, if you think that Squenix's current implementation of TAU AF is a good solution, you must have a pretty poor imagination.

Coffer crowding assumes that coffers pieces are restricted to one zone, which is far from necessary. There are 18 zones with coffers in this game... that means that you could have up to 6 zones for each coffer piece. Who says that COR AF hands would have to drop only in one zone?

Furthermore, other than the ridiculous positioning of the Astral Mirror in Arrapago (which they later corrected), I don't see people complaining about the actual quested COR AF. How about 6 real quests (instead of 3), one for each piece?

The current implementation is not only lazy, but poorly designed. The fact that people have to recommend "just wait to get your AF!" as a supposed solution pretty much shows that. Squenix knew full well that there were going to be a lot of players aiming to get AF, and they should have designed the quests as such.

[Murphie]

I'm not sure I understand why SE should set something up one way for all time just because in the beginning there are going to be a lot of people doing it. If folks weren't so impatient, it wouldn't be an issue.

[Spider-Dan]

I'm not sure I understand why SE should set something up one way for all time just because in the beginning there are going to be a lot of people doing it. If folks weren't so impatient, it wouldn't be an issue.
I'm not sure I understand why Squenix would set up something in a way that they know will cause a problem at the start. Why not set it up the right way to begin with? There's no good reason not to.

[Mhurron]

I'm not sure I understand why Squenix would set up something in a way that they know will cause a problem at the start. Why not set it up the right way to begin with? There's no good reason not to.What is the 'right way?' No matter what they did this thread was going to be made by someone. What was 'right' for you might not have been 'right' for the other 499,999 people that play the game. This way, coffers, BCNM's or whatever they could have done would not change the fact that everyone who was leveling these jobs was going to rush out *RIGHT NOW* and do the AF quests. There was going to be a problem once it went live but the thing is it doesn't matter because once it's passed it won't happen again.

[Murphie]

I'm not sure I understand why Squenix would set up something in a way that they know will cause a problem at the start. Why not set it up the right way to begin with? There's no good reason not to.Basically what Mhurron just posted here. But seriously, what is the right way? I have yet to see anyone here post a suggestion that is a more useful alternative to what SE already did. At most, it's just a different way, but by no means better.

[Spider-Dan]

Having 6 real quests (instead of 3 "quests" where you buy your AF) is a much better option than what was implemented. There are no crowding problems whatsoever in the 3 real COR AF quests, even though "everyone was trying to do them at the same time."

[Mhurron]

Just like there were no crowding problems for the pass to Aht Urgan when it was first released right?

[Murphie]

At this point is there any crowding on the other three? This thread was started before the last update, so I don't really know. No one in my LS seems to be complaining about it anymore.

[Spider-Dan]

Just like there were no crowding problems for the pass to Aht Urgan when it was first released right?
That's an excellent analogy. Because there are over 500 CORs of AF level on each server, right?

The plain and simple fact is that there were no crowding problems on COR AF1-AF3, period. That's because those quests were actually well-designed, in contrast to the other three.

P.S. The TAU pass quest was poorly designed. Having every single player on the server funnel through ONE NPC behind a door that requires a CS to enter = retarded.

[Murphie]

There could very well be 500 CORS of AF level on every server. I have no way of proving or disproving that. Just as I can't prove that there were any crowding problems on the quest, seeing as I'm only on one server.

Overall, I haven't encountered that many people that seem to have a problem with the new AF quests. Just a small (but extremely) vocal minority.

[Mhurron]

That's an excellent analogy. Because there are over 500 CORs of AF level on each server, right?

The plain and simple fact is that there were no crowding problems on COR AF1-AF3, period.And it seems there are no problems with the rest of the AF either, or with getting your Aht Urgan pass now. This is why it didn't matter, after the initial rush the number of people reaching AF levels would be the same steady trickle of people going after any other section of the game.

And once again, it didn't matter what SE did, it never does. No matter what was implimented this thread would exist, maybe it would have been started by someone else with another bone to pick, but it would still be here. And chances are someone would say they would like the chance to be able to buy their AF instead of having to do 6 quests for it.

[Spider-Dan]

There could very well be 500 CORS of AF level on every server.
OK, I think this pretty well establishes that you aren't interested in discussing reality. Gee, I guess there could be 2000 75DRGs on every server too, huh?

And it seems there are no problems with the rest of the AF either, or with getting your Aht Urgan pass now. This is why it didn't matter, after the initial rush the number of people reaching AF levels would be the same steady trickle of people going after any other section of the game.
Ummm, duh? If the problem is crowding, and you just wait until the crowding is over, then of course the problem is "solved," by definition. That's like saying that there was no problem with the update patches about 12-18 months ago (when lots of people had problems logging in to download patches)... sure, if you just wait until everyone else has done their update, then you can download it just fine.

That, however, does nothing to solve the original problem. That's called "ignoring the problem until it goes away."

[Murphie]

There could be. How would we know if they aren't online all at the same time? There are more likely something like 100 or so, but that's still a lot of people to compete with. Not to mention the other folks doing BLU and PUP AF too.

But hey, if you want to be insulting, then there's really no point in continuing. I mean, I get that you're all angry and stuff about how mean SE is, but as I said before, most people don't seem to have a problem with it.

EDIT: That's not called "Ignoring a problem until it goes away", that's called "Not being impatient and expecting everything now now now."

[Mhurron]

That, however, does nothing to solve the original problem. That's called "ignoring the problem until it goes away."You do not throw away ideas because of a temporary problem that can not be avoided and will only exist once ever. If in less then a week the problem is gone, for all intents and purposes there was no problem. This thread is crying over spilt milk.

[SonikU4ia]

Thinking about it, I don't really see another way SE could have made crowding problems any easier when it comes to newly released events. Well, I say that, but it can be done if you want to be stupid about it. I mean, there's so many zones in the game, it could have been possible for SE to simply make coffers available in the wilderness and allow people to open coffers and all party members wanting the AF quest benefit, not just one.

To be honest, I strangely enjoy the idea of AF being annoying and sometimes difficult to get, because the challenge in that makes it quite fun; not to mention, finding a way to solo all of your AF. I have soloed the last 4 sets of AF for different characters I play and that is very rewarding to me.

Crowding problems are shared by MMORPGs the world (no pun intended) over. Every MMORPG I've played have had this issue. Hell, the MMORGP I played previous to FF11 was the ridiculous Everquest Online Adventures for the PS2. I was playing a Wizard and one of my quests invovled hunting down a stupid witch to kill her to advance for something.... I forget now... and she only spawned like once every 2 hours. That bish was always camped, so I gave up on that quest. Yeh, it sucked, I felt it could be done better, but how? If you cheapen the quest, then sure, yah, ok. In a sense, taking away the challenge rather blunts the sharp end of the object. The object being the game itself.

I think for the most part, these types of issues will simply require patience. Dynamis is an exercise and a half in patience. I've always dreamed about wanting Mjllonir for my WHM, since I like healer characters so much. I've been playing for almost 3 years and I still haven't even aquired the step 1 hammer...... I guess I could complain about it like a whinning wuss and say that "SE is not fair they make me wait for the items I want I feel like /wrists..."

lol

[Spider-Dan]

If you cheapen the quest, then sure, yah, ok. In a sense, taking away the challenge rather blunts the sharp end of the object. The object being the game itself.

I think for the most part, these types of issues will simply require patience. Dynamis is an exercise and a half in patience. I've always dreamed about wanting Mjllonir for my WHM, since I like healer characters so much. I've been playing for almost 3 years and I still haven't even aquired the step 1 hammer...... I guess I could complain about it like a whinning wuss and say that "SE is not fair they make me wait for the items I want I feel like /wrists..."
This presumes that part of the "challenge" of AF is intended to be fighting through crowds, in which case... where's the challenge now? Is AF designed to be arbitrarily easier 2 weeks after it's released?

It's very simple; either crowding is something that's planned for, or it isn't. If it is planned for, then why would the buyable AF "quests" be so much easier with no crowds? If it isn't, then that just proves my point; the problems with crowding are due simply to laziness and a lack of foresight on the part of Squenix. There is nothing whatsoever preventing Squenix from designing the quests so that crowding is not a factor; as evidence, I cite COR AF1-AF3.

[SonikU4ia]

This presumes that part of the "challenge" of AF is intended to be fighting through crowds, in which case... where's the challenge now? Is AF designed to be arbitrarily easier 2 weeks after it's released?

This assumes you have the mind of SE. Arbitrarily? Assuming, SE was trying to go the route of making AF more easily accessible to people in ToAU instead of having the coffers spawn next to a LV78 mob, while keeping to the same area and not losing the luster of new jobs in new areas w/new af, while still balacing out other game issues that AF is dependent on, then obviously arbitrarily, no. It's more possible that SE couldn't help the fact that crowding was imminent. SE being capable of forseeing this and coming up with another solution to crowding? Arbitrarily, I would be willing to wager they felt that making the quests easier by buying them in that sense, would be the solution to other possible scenarios. They more than likely looked at the big picture and felt this was the best, safest way. (I still don't like it, but I'm just being nit-picky. I would prefer the challenge of a quest anyday to monotonous gil farming to obtain my AF.) As soon as the hoopla dies down, AF would get easier in the sense that you don't battle against lag w/other people in a crowded place. SE was more than likely aware of this.(Something that seems more or less worthless to complain about. Rather, grow a pair and deal with it, should be the motto of the day?) I'm sure they figured people would get their feathers ruffled slightly and eventually it would smooth out. It just so happens, here is a thread w/posts in it about someone's feathers being ruffled. Here, have a tissue. /item "Kleenex box" <me>

I am fine with them doing what they did. I certainly don't agree with some of it, but in the end, looking at the big picture, could it have been helped. Feel free to offer alternative solutions to help sway my opinion and that of the community that I'm sure your grossly fond of. Otherwise, no more arguement is worth depicting at this point without some solutions.

It's very simple; either crowding is something that's planned for, or it isn't. If it is planned for, then why would the buyable AF "quests" be so much easier with no crowds? If it isn't, then that just proves my point; the problems with crowding are due simply to laziness and a lack of foresight on the part of Squenix. There is nothing whatsoever preventing Squenix from designing the quests so that crowding is not a factor; as evidence, I cite COR AF1-AF3.

I'm beginning to form this opinion that SE is "damned if they do, damned if they don't" when it comes to situations about crowd control. I don't see any viable, "logical" ways to control ppl from crowding into one place at one time when newly released events are introduced into FF11. Remember when, at one point, people were overcrowding Aht Urghan, GMs would log into the server and declare "At this time, players need to move uot of the Aht Urghan areas as to stop overcrowding the zone. If the situation does not get resolved, we will be forcibly removing players from the zone, until the situation is under control." In addition, SE institued Auction Taxes into Aht Urghan were previously it wasn't present, and allowed players the ability to access their mog locker from anywhere in the world.

Signs point to the fact that SE possibly either "didn't forsee the potential crowding of areas" or "knew of the risks of introducing new events and the potential crowding, but had no real easy win/win situation and just waited to see how the community would react and adjust accordingly." I can't berate for SE not trying. On the surface of things, yeh, it seems like their lazy. But for me to say that is myself just being lazy and not looking into facts and speculating to try to form a better understanding. In hinesight, sure ok. They probably had good reasons. I should give them the benefit of the doubt. Besides, this isn't a completely unintelligent company. They are rather rich are they not? Just like anyone and anything else, they can miss the mark now and then.

Stating your words, its just as "simple as that." :D

[Awilo]

imperial silk prices is dropping down because they made a recipe for it now, if I have to farm every single piece of my AF, I will do. I am lvl 56 soon on my way to 57 and gave up on getting my BlU AF stuffs until I reach lvl 60/65 for dynamis/sky ls. frankly complaining is just not helping. Sure getting your AF crafted was bound to be expensive as it is with all the new stuffs coming out but I find it better than people who have to wait weeks to find a party to help them get their AF. You think the AF material cost too much? well just skip it for now and come back when you can afford it.

[Spider-Dan]

Assuming, SE was trying to go the route of making AF more easily accessible to people in ToAU instead of having the coffers spawn next to a LV78 mob, while keeping to the same area and not losing the luster of new jobs in new areas w/new af, while still balacing out other game issues that AF is dependent on, then obviously arbitrarily, no.
Who says that the only two solutions are "coffers" or "buying AF"?

It's more possible that SE couldn't help the fact that crowding was imminent.
They seem to have managed it pretty well on COR AF1-AF3, like I've already said multiple times.

(I still don't like it, but I'm just being nit-picky. I would prefer the challenge of a quest anyday to monotonous gil farming to obtain my AF.)
From what it sounds like, you'd also prefer that they had implemented it differently than they did, yet you're arguing for the status quo because...?

SE was more than likely aware of this.(Something that seems more or less worthless to complain about. Rather, grow a pair and deal with it, should be the motto of the day?) I'm sure they figured people would get their feathers ruffled slightly and eventually it would smooth out. It just so happens, here is a thread w/posts in it about someone's feathers being ruffled. Here, have a tissue. /item "Kleenex box" <me>
So then, they knew it would happen, they had the capability of preventing it, but chose not to (for no discernible reason). How can you justify this?

I am fine with them doing what they did. I certainly don't agree with some of it, but in the end, looking at the big picture, could it have been helped. Feel free to offer alternative solutions to help sway my opinion and that of the community that I'm sure your grossly fond of. Otherwise, no more arguement is worth depicting at this point without some solutions.
I've already provided multiple solutions in this thread (that took me a whole 5min to imagine); they were quickly ignored, or pooh-poohed with the reasoning of, "well, someone would have complained about something else anyway," which doesn't even address the question at hand. People shouldn't rhetorically ask for solutions if they're going to automatically dismiss them with responses like that, or like this:

I'm beginning to form this opinion that SE is "damned if they do, damned if they don't" when it comes to situations about crowd control.
Once more: on COR AF1-AF3, overcrowding was no problem whatsoever. So it's far from "damned if they do, damned if they don't;" more like just "damned if they don't." Designing quests with some modicum of intelligence and awareness (as AF1-AF3 are) prevents such issues. If Squenix had designed COR AF1 with a ??? that had a midnight JPT repop time, that wouldn't be the players' fault for being impatient; it'd be Squenix's fault for being stupid.

It's not like I'm comparing them to some utopian standard of perfect quests that don't exist. I'm pointing directly at the other three COR AF quests and saying, "These three quests work and are designed so that overcrowding isn't a problem; why can't all the COR AF quests work like this?"

How is that some crazy, unreasonable request?