A few questions for the Veterans.

[Meth]

Ok, so last night I finally hit 41 and have begun my life as a refresh cow. I have just a few questions for you more experienced RDMs out there....

1. I am an Elvaan, so I have high MND but low MP and INT. Currently I use electrum rings, would I be better served macro'ing INT and MND rings, while swapping electrums in my Convert macro? I know that sounds obvious, and I only ask because at this point I don't get resists so I don't know if it's worth the time and gil.

2. As for refresh, currently I cast refresh on me, then mages (haven't partied with a PLD yet). Some RDM friends have told me to wait until mine wears off, then restart the cycle; others have told me to try and overwrite refresh before it wears (like I would as a bard). Which method is more realistic as I grow in level?

Thanks in advance! :)

[nanatsu]

1. Some people like to macro in INT and MND gear in to maximize the effectiveness of their enfeebles. If you're the type that likes to get every ounce of power out of your spells then try it. The effects are more noticeble at the lower levels than they are at the higher ones, so as you get higher you might find yourself relying on it less and less. But it's always good to have gear swaps to maximize your effectiveness in my opinion.

2. Just overwrite it if you need to start a refresh cycle. Then refresh the people who need it in a set order. You need to always start with yourself first so you can keep track of everyone. Once yours wears off, by the time you cast it on yourself again you'll know it's time to cast it on the next person. There are other ways to do it, but this is the easiest way and you're less likely to get bitched at by refresh hungry mages. A typical refresh cycle is You > PLD > WHM > BLM > DRK if he needs it.

[Icemage]

Ok, so last night I finally hit 41 and have begun my life as a refresh cow. I have just a few questions for you more experienced RDMs out there....

1. I am an Elvaan, so I have high MND but low MP and INT. Currently I use electrum rings, would I be better served macro'ing INT and MND rings, while swapping electrums in my Convert macro? I know that sounds obvious, and I only ask because at this point I don't get resists so I don't know if it's worth the time and gil.


Saintly Ring+1s are relatively inexpensive and quite useful. Swap two of them in when casting Slow and Stoneskin at least - they'll increase the potency of both spells. No reason to have Electrum Rings on when casting spells except right after Converting.


2. As for refresh, currently I cast refresh on me, then mages (haven't partied with a PLD yet). Some RDM friends have told me to wait until mine wears off, then restart the cycle; others have told me to try and overwrite refresh before it wears (like I would as a bard). Which method is more realistic as I grow in level?

Thanks in advance! :)

Every RDM has a preference. Low base MP races seem to prefer the recast-when-it-wears approach since it's most efficient (you get the full return on your investment). Some people have very good sense of time and learn how to recast right as it wears, but honestly the difference in performance is minimal either way.


Icemage

[TheGrandMom]

Every RDM has a preference. Low base MP races seem to prefer the recast-when-it-wears approach since it's most efficient (you get the full return on your investment). Some people have very good sense of time and learn how to recast right as it wears, but honestly the difference in performance is minimal either way.

Icemage

I agree, you'll eventually develop a "sixth sense" for when refresh is about to wear. You're brand new at this so give it some time. Or you can get yourself a cheap kitchen timer and use that to let you know when approx. the refresh chain is going to need to be started again. But in the end, you'll use it less and less because it will just become habit.

[Aeni]

Saintly Ring+1s are relatively inexpensive and quite useful. Swap two of them in when casting Slow and Stoneskin at least - they'll increase the potency of both spells. No reason to have Electrum Rings on when casting spells except right after Converting.



Every RDM has a preference. Low base MP races seem to prefer the recast-when-it-wears approach since it's most efficient (you get the full return on your investment). Some people have very good sense of time and learn how to recast right as it wears, but honestly the difference in performance is minimal either way.


Icemage

Yes, I agree with this. In some situations, you cannot actively monitor the refresh clock, so you try to "guessimate" and make sure the people that needs to really be refreshed are (Like PLD in a drawn out fight)

[Jei]

I start the cycle on myself, and recast when I see the wear off effects too. Usually I am too busy casting other stuffs to time my refresh, even with a stop watch I doubt I'll get to look at it that much ^^;

When I was lower level, inventory space was quite crucial so I tried to minimize the gear I had to carry. So I didn't start carrying any MND or INT gear until much later on. up until ~60 I only tried to keep my HP : MP as close as I can with both gears and pies. Using pies will give you more equipment slots to put on MND gear without having to switch out MP gears.

[Kristine]

For about 20 levels of RDM I kept one electrum/astral (after I afforded to upgrade)... and used the other ring slot for an INT ring (had a lot of MND in other slots, namely Promise Badge), since I didn't find 3 more MND in that slot necessary due to being elvaan... then used that slot for another MP ring during convert. Unless my party was super power killing (ie the days before RNG nerf), I didn't have resist issues with the setup I had.

As for my refresh cycle... I always start on myself, go to PLD>WHM>BLM>Whatever in that order every time, sometimes swapping haste as needed. I always wait till it wears off on myself so I know when it's time to recast... primarily because I can't remember when the spell will wear off (even after two years of playing the job, I just suck at that >.>;).

[Taskmage]

I used to go with the recast when it wears approach. That is definately the easiest to get a handle on. Not too long ago I learned that Refresh wears off almost exactly one Vana'diel hour after being cast, so I started noting the time on the in-game clock when I cast Refresh, and then I would start the next cycle just before that, so Refresh fade in the middle of my cast and then get immediately replaced. As others have said, though, the difference is very minimal, but I'm happy with my technique.

[Patchinko]

I used to go with the recast when it wears approach. That is definately the easiest to get a handle on. Not too long ago I learned that Refresh wears off almost exactly one Vana'diel hour after being cast, so I started noting the time on the in-game clock when I cast Refresh, and then I would start the next cycle just before that, so Refresh fade in the middle of my cast and then get immediately replaced. As others have said, though, the difference is very minimal, but I'm happy with my technique.

Yes, this is the trick I used to use and it works very well.＾＾ Watch the clock!

[Aeni]

I used to go with the recast when it wears approach. That is definately the easiest to get a handle on. Not too long ago I learned that Refresh wears off almost exactly one Vana'diel hour after being cast, so I started noting the time on the in-game clock when I cast Refresh, and then I would start the next cycle just before that, so Refresh fade in the middle of my cast and then get immediately replaced. As others have said, though, the difference is very minimal, but I'm happy with my technique.

I can do that as well, but honestly, in a sticky situation, it's almost difficult to pull this off 100% of the time. Thus, I usually try the sensible approach of who's important. Sometimes I can change the order of my cycle on the fly, depending on the situation.

I rarely start off with PLD as 2nd after myself in a cycle, unless the PLD is acting as a semi-mainhealer (In only one PT this happened and she was a damn good PLD for backing me up on healing duties so I *had* to place her 2nd in refresh cycle and priority over the BLM in the PT)

[Jei]

I think refreshing the pld sooner is a good idea. They can't function without MP and can't sit whenever they want to. So whether they're using it or not, I just keep them refreshed.

[Nyru]

Good suggestions here :)

The only thing I would want to add is about the changing of equipment mentioned. You will find as you get into different lvls with new mobs, your resist rate will change.

Please don't get rid of any old rings/earrings configurations because you are done with them. I made the mistake of selling off some older gear thinking I was "past that stage," only to re-purchase them later :P

I prefer to have more MP, but I carry extra enfeeb enhancing gear in case I run into trouble in that area.

[Meth]

Once again thanks for the responses. I still have my INT and MND rings hady, so I'll take the advice and macro them in.

[Aeni]

I think refreshing the pld sooner is a good idea. They can't function without MP and can't sit whenever they want to. So whether they're using it or not, I just keep them refreshed.

I disagree. That's what the new auto-refresh is there for. If the PLD isn't using the MP, trust me, auto-refresh more than makes up for the sometime-usage and I get to keep my 40 mp instead of having 100+ mp (potential) go to waste...

[Lilani]

Ok, so last night I finally hit 41 and have begun my life as a refresh cow. I have just a few questions for you more experienced RDMs out there....

1. I am an Elvaan, so I have high MND but low MP and INT. Currently I use electrum rings, would I be better served macro'ing INT and MND rings, while swapping electrums in my Convert macro? I know that sounds obvious, and I only ask because at this point I don't get resists so I don't know if it's worth the time and gil.

2. As for refresh, currently I cast refresh on me, then mages (haven't partied with a PLD yet). Some RDM friends have told me to wait until mine wears off, then restart the cycle; others have told me to try and overwrite refresh before it wears (like I would as a bard). Which method is more realistic as I grow in level?

Thanks in advance! :)
1. Only problem is that if you swap in your electrums right before convert it's +40 MP right? Well, you convert, heal, and then you change them out and all of the sudden you're down 40 MP again. Unless your cure uses more than 40 MP it's really not worth the effort. I suggest that you have those electrums on all the time, so that when you level up or recover MP you have the most at all times. And for your INT and MND, get earrings or other gear that enhances your INT (and maybe MND too). Remember: Magic Chuises (sp?) level 48 leg gear, +3 INT and MND.

And melon pies will be your friend too, they boost INT and MP.

2. My refresh cycle goes me > PLD > WHM > SMN > BLM > DRK (only when they need it). BLU, however, is a special case. Put BLU wherever in the cycle they are covering for. Like today I had a party and our BLU was the healer. In the beginning I went me > PLD > BLU, but I noticed he was wearing a vermy cloak. I asked him if I could just not refresh him and he said it was ok.

As for overwriting it before it wears...just go tell them to get RDM to 50 or so and see if they can handle it. As you go up in levels and gain new responsibilities (haste and erase if you sub WHM level 64+) you simply won't be able to remember exactly when you first casted it. So just be alert and make sure you notice when yours wears and you'll be fine. I've never had a party expect me to know *exactly* when mine was going to wear and know *exactly* when to recast. And if I did I would disband+warp on the spot.

[Seijurohiko]

Cure III costs 46 MP. Cure IV, which we get at level 48, costs 88 mp. Most RDM will cast at least one of these spells on themselves immediately following a Convert. Here's a hypothetical, but very common situtation: You are mid-chain and sitting on 30/460 MP (without Electrum Rings equiped), getting ready to use Convert. Let's say your HP is someting like 590/600.

If you equip your Electrum Rings just before Converting, your MP is at 30/500. Use Convert, now you're at 30/560 HP and 500/500 MP. A quick Cure III puts you at about 210/560 HP, 454/500 MP. If you were to remove your rings at this point, your MP would go from 454/500 to 454/460 - which is exactly the same amount. Once you've finished casting your post-convert cure spell, those MP rings are doing exactly nothing for you, or your party. They are as good as having nothing equiped in that slot.

So, if you have the inventory space, there's no reason not to carry a set of +MND rings, and a set of +INT rings along with those MP rings. Macro'ing them in (along with any other relevant +stat gear) will only serve to make your magic stronger, and more effective.

[nazlfrag]

Excellent explanation Seijurohiko. I reccomend putting +MND or +INT ring swaps before all your buff/debuff and nuke spells. With NQ rings, its the equivalent of having another solid wand, and HQ a rose wand+1. NQ rings (saintlys, eremite's) should be cheap, and they are very effective for the price. Electrums are great for convert, you should also swap them in when resting mp.

As far as refresh goes, the /clock on method works best. With our woefully low mp pool, it's best to optimize it to cast when it wears so you get the full 150mp back. While a bard would overwrite them, he doesn't have a tiny MP pool to stretch out either.

On food, I'm addicted to goblin mushpot. With the +10 mnd on top of our already high mnd it makes our white enfeebles just awesome. I rarely have to recast paralyze or slow because of resists. The lack of +MP, and the fact it does nothing for our weak int don't make it the best choice, though.

Here melon pies shine through, covering our weaknesses of low int and mp. The +1 version lasts twice as long, has an extra +1int and importantly, +2hMP. Those 2 extra mp/tick of healing can make all the difference to an elvaan.

I also like witch kabobs or mushroom stew when in a healing role, and reccomend them over mushpots (even though I'm hooked on them). The combo of +MP, +Mnd and +hMP is very useful.

I'm only level 50, but I've been using ring swaps since around level 20 and haven't looked back.

[Meth]

Put in the ring swap macros and they work like a charm. Also, the one game hour refresf timer is dead on. I strated with myself at the top of each hour, and it would wear off as I was recasting. Thanks again for the tips!

[Aeni]

2. My refresh cycle goes me > PLD > WHM > SMN > BLM > DRK (only when they need it). BLU, however, is a special case. Put BLU wherever in the cycle they are covering for. Like today I had a party and our BLU was the healer. In the beginning I went me > PLD > BLU, but I noticed he was wearing a vermy cloak. I asked him if I could just not refresh him and he said it was ok.

That's wrong to ask. LOL ... of course, not sure why BLU is healer, but oh well. If anything, they should be upfront beating down on the mobs like any DD and you guys should've picked up a real healer (Or you should've subbed WHM and main healed for that PT)

Anyway, in one party I was in before:

BLU/NIN BLU/WAR COR/NIN DRG/NIN BLM/WHM RDM/WHM

I refreshed both BLUs even when I would see them swap in Dark Staves and VC. Generally, you won't get more than 20-30 MP back resting if your puller is pulling correctly, which is pulling while making sure you have enough MP to get through to the next fight, counting COR's rolls and RDM's refresh. If anyone is slacking, then you're going to have tremendous downtime.

I generally see it a waste for pullers to wait for mages to get back even 60% of their MP pool, unless they're blowing 100% of it on every fight (Which means that the party has no business fighting whatever it is they're fighting)

[Taskmage]

blu/whm is a decent main heal after Magic Fruit, I hear. I don't know why you would ever cut the main healer out of a refresh cycle though, vermy or not. Their mp is your exp and your well being. If you're getting decent and safe exp with them just getting 1 mp/tick with vermy, you'll get better, safer exp from them getting 4 mp/tick from vermy+refresh.

[Icemage]

Always, always, always keep Refresh on BLU. They burn through MP faster than any other type of mage other than RDM - even with Auto-Refresh and Vermillion Cloak and Sanction Refresh, it's still not enough to keep them topped up.

One thing I've learned about MP and Refresh - give good players Refresh even when close to their limit, and they'll find a use for it.


Icemage

[massaranger]

2. As for refresh, currently I cast refresh on me, then mages (haven't partied with a PLD yet). Some RDM friends have told me to wait until mine wears off, then restart the cycle; others have told me to try and overwrite refresh before it wears (like I would as a bard). Which method is more realistic as I grow in level?

Thanks in advance! :)[/QUOTE]

best is to wait till ursw wears as a elf you have low mp and you need as much as you can specialy if your gonna be parts of MB's