Implementing Time Mage as a class in FFXI

[Kalledon]

Since my Geomancer thread got good response I thought doing a Time Mage one would also be good. Enjoy

EDIT: Changed around some abilities after listening to other poster suggestions.



The Time Mage is mostly a support class with some damaging abilities.

Time Mage Overview:
-Mage armor (no different from WHM or BLM save AF)
-Focus on temporal magic
-Uses enhancing/enfeebling decently

Time Mages are an interesting class. They have been present in FFV and both FF Tactics. The purpose of the Time Mage is to mainly support the party by temporal boosts such as haste or warp. They also are able to temporally debuff the enemies by slowing them down or even stopping them in their tracks. Time Mages have also been know to have access to damaging spells like gravity or demi (depending on what game you are playing) and some of the stronger spells like X-Zone and Meteor.

A Time Mage would work like any other mage class in that it uses mp to cast spells and it learns said spells by using scrolls at the appropriate level. Since most of the Time Mages' spells all ready exist and those that don’t would fall under existing categories, Time Mage’s would require the following magic skills: Enhancing, Enfeebling, and a new skill Temporal. The Temporal magic skill would include spells like Demi and Meteor.

Since a Time Mage’s attack spells are limited, they would also be semi decent in melee (slightly lower than a red mages).

------------COMPLETE CLASS DEFINITION-----------------

Combat/Magic Skills
Temporal: A
Enhancing: B-
Enfeebling: B-
Dagger: C
Club: C
Staff: A
Parrying: C
Evasion: C

New Spells:
Demi, Demi II, Demi III, Demi IV, Demiga, Demiga II, Demiga III – basic temporal attack spells--deals temporal damage; using gravity and temporal manipulations, the Time Mage bends his enemies’ body causing damage (note. This is not the tradition Demi in that it does 25% of a mobs hp--see Quarter. This is basically the same as Fire, Stone, Water, etc only it is Temporal based instead of elemental)

Quarter - Temporal attack spell that deals damage equal to 25% of the mob's remaining hp. Has a low chance of success and a long casting time. Automatically fails on NM's and other special enemies.

Meteor, Meteo – powerful temporal attack spells (Meteor-single enemy, Meteo-AoE)

Stop, Stop II – enfeebling spell that halts an enemy for a certain period of time preventing it from performing any actions (Stop would have a medium to high chance of success but only a low amount of time actually affecting the mob, maybe only 5-10 seconds; Stop II would last longer but have a much lower chance of success) Unlike stun which completely kills an enemy action, Stop only prevents the action from continuing. Once stop wears of the mob continues on as if nothing happened (ie. If a mob starts casting a spell and you cast stop on it the spell timer freezes in the middle and picks up again when the spell wears off).

Blur, Blur II, Bluraga, Bluraga II - increases evasion of target/party (names subject to better suggestion)

MHaste, MHaste II - increase casting speed or decreases casting time depending on how you look at it

Age - increases the mobs level by 1*
Age II - increases the mobs level by 5*
Youthen - decreases the mobs level by 1*
Youthen II - decreases the mobs level by 5*
*If caster loses claim to this mob then the spell wears off. Does not work on NM's. Also the spell must be cast before the mob takes damage or it will fail.

Rewind - When cast on a player it shows up as a buff on that player and when it wears off (after say 30 seconds) the players stats are reset to what they were when the buff took effect. Wouldn't work if player died or if the buff was dispelled.

Float, Float II - increases resistance to Earth based spells

Quicken - allows target's next ability/spell to ignore any cooldown timers or casting time. This does not work on 2hr abilities and it has a very long recast timer of it's own.

Hastega, Slowega, Graviga, Haste II, Slow II, Gravity II – stronger or AoE versions of existing spells.

Spell Progression (by Level)
1. Demi
5. Bind
7. Youthen
9. Slow
11. Age
13. Warp
15. Blur
17. Stop
19. Gravity
21. Tractor
23. Demiga
25. Escape
27. Demi II
29. Bluraga
30. Youthen II
31. Graviga
33. Float
34. Age II
35. Haste
37. MHaste
38. Quicken
38. Warp 2
39. Slowega
40. Blur II
41. Hastega
42. Rewind
43. Demiga II
45. Slow II
45. Quarter
46. Float II
47. Bluraga II
49. Gravity II
50. Meteor
53. Stop II
55. Demi III
59. Haste II
61. MHaste II
63. Demiga III
67. Demi IV
70. Meteo

Job Abilities
Lv1: X-Zone
Effect: The Time Mage casts an enemy mob into another dimension for a certain period of time or possibly even killing it. (Depending on the mob’s difficulty would equal how long it stays in there. A easy or not worth it mob would die instantly, a decent challenge would go in for say 30 seconds, an even match would go for 25, tough for 20, very tough for 15, incredibly tough for 10, and anything higher for 5; also depending on how long its in there = how much damage it receives).
Recast: 2 hours.

Lv15: Cosmic Seal
Effect: Makes the next Temporal spell double in power.
Duration: 1 spell cast. Lasts 30 seconds after cast.
Recast: 15 minutes.

Lvl40: Mirror Image
Effect: Greatly increases the Time Mage's evasion by making the mob see multiple versions of himself.
Duration: 1 minute
Recast: 5 minutes

Job Traits
Lv10: Slow Resistance
Effect: Slightly increases resistance to slow spells.

Lvl15: Bind Resistance
Effect: Slightly increases resistance to being bound.

Lv25: Temporal Defense
Effect: Increases defense against temporal spells (no reason to think mobs wouldn’t get them also).

Lv35: Auto Haste
Effect: Slightly increases attack speed.

Lvl40: Slow Resistance II
Effect: Further increases resistance to slow spells.

Lvl45: Bind Resistance II
Effect: Further increases resistance to being bound.

Lv50: Temporal Defense II
Effect: Further increases defense against temporal spells.

Lvl60: Auto Haste II
Effect: Further increases attack speed.

[Discordian]

Redmage/Dark Knight

Slow
Paralyze (Changes the speed of attacks due to interuption)
Haste
Gravity (More damage over time due to reduced movement)
Blind
Stun (1-2 second STOP)

[Macht]

Geomancer is still pretty tough for me to see working, even though geomancer has a possibility. Time Mage however I still don't any way it could possibly, the abilities it has I could be being abused to no ends. On top of which how will SE be able to stop people from doing crazy things like kiting a monster for hours if they start encouraging it with more spells to help with that very possibility?

[Ghostraven]

I really don't think you can have a %based damage spell in this game.

4 timemages casting Demi I = the chance to oneshot an EXP mob.
That's overpowered.

The only way I see Demi in this game is as an ancient magic that uses ubsurd amounts of MP and an insane recast time.
Even then what's to stop Timemage alliances from trying to oneshot HNM's/Gods?

[fuz]

They need a throw exp skill, kind of like toss gil, except you use exp to do damage. :thumbsup:

[LadyPeorth]

Hmmm balancing Demi is tough. Demi in most FF games is darkness based and deals damage = to % of HP. Demi technically has a high resist rate as it is incredibly powerful.

First of all: Element. Obviously darkness based and based off the Dark Magic Skill and Time Magic Skill. By basing it off two skills rather than one, this can offer the balance to the Time mage whom has let their Dark Magic skill go to nothing. The formula would probably work like this:

Natural Demi Resist = (NDR)
Dark Magic skill = (DMS)
Time Mag skill = (TMS)
HP Lost = HPL
Monster Level = ML
Player Level = PL

Resist = [(ML-PL)-(TMS/DMS-DMS/TMS)]+(NDR)

This means resist is calculated by taking the difference of Monster and Player Levels, then subtracing the difference between Dark Magic skill and Time magic skill (higher one is assumed as the one being subtracted from to keep this number is either positive or 0). This means in an EXP PT, it has less of a chance to land than during a farming trip.

HPL = 1/Resist + 1%

So if you are 75, taking a level 80 non-NM monster that's not darkness aligned, with capped skills the numbers would be:
Resist = [(80-75)-(276-276)]+25
Resist = (5-0)+25
Resist = 30%

HPL = 1/30 + 1%
HPL = .033333 + 1%
HPL = 4% HP lost

The more difference in skill, higher monster resists, less HP is loss. Notorious Monsters and Darkness based monsters would have a higher NDR.

Demi would have a 10 second casting time and a 1 minute cooldown.

Demi of higher demoninations would just adjust the added %, approximately +2 per level. So Demi 4 with same conditions would be:

Resist = 30% (unchanged)
HPL = 1/30 + 7%
HPL = 0.03333 +7%
HPL = 10%

Demi would use MP of 10xDemi level + HP loss of monster/2. Monster loses 1000 life with Demi 4, you lose 540 MP.

What does everyone think?

My post copied from the other Time Mage thread on how to Balance Demi.

[Kalledon]

Okay, maybe I didn't clarify Demi well enough. It's strictly a damage skill with no percentage. It's figured out by taking the Time Mages Int and Temporal skill and comparing to a mob's Temporal defense.

Quarter is the percentage spell and you only get a 25% damage that does not necessarilly succeed. On the concern that this would allow 4 TIM's to one shot a mob it wouldn't work. Assuming they all actually got the spell off, it would go 25% leaving 75% of the mobs hp then take another 25% leaving it with 56% of its hp then the 3rd 25% leavign the mob with 42% of it's hp, and then the 4th leaving the mob with 32% of it's total hp. And that is assuming they all went off and didn't get resisted.

[kuu]

Quarter is the percentage spell and you only get a 25% damage that does not necessarilly succeed. On the concern that this would allow 4 TIM's to one shot a mob it wouldn't work. Assuming they all actually got the spell off, it would go 25% leaving 75% of the mobs hp then take another 25% leaving it with 56% of its hp then the 3rd 25% leavign the mob with 42% of it's hp, and then the 4th leaving the mob with 32% of it's total hp. And that is assuming they all went off and didn't get resisted.

Nope not on your life.

that means by the 10th spell, all HNMs are waiting to be picked off.

And no matter how high the resistance, something like subbing "elemental seal" would break it through.

It's just not a good concept, and introducing something like "temporal elemental" means a lot of bugs, and balanancing issues. I.E lots of coding.

This is something management vs Development teams will always come to heads with. Just because you can think it doesn't mean it's easy to build.

[Jei]

i think time mage should just concern about time space. If you look at it this way, I'm thinking about recast timers on abilities and such. Something along this line would be, imo

- A spell that adds fast cast effect on target member
- an ability that resets other member's ability timers.
- And have their 2hrs actually reset other member's SP.


Now that sounds like something unique :biggrin: might be a lil over power if pair if SMN but hey, just a thought for fun :p No "that's not balance waaaa" please. just have fun.

[Feenicks]

I think the Stop spells are a worthy addition, also something along the lines of the Delay attacks in FFX would be useful. Something that, if cast while the enemy is casting, it adds delay onto the time it takes to get the spell/ability off.

Say for example an HNM starts casting ancient magic - you cast Delay on the mob and it takes an extra 20% casting time or so to complete casting, give or take a few seconds with respect to resistance. Give the spell a high cooldown and quick cast time like Flash or Stun and it could work.

Hastega I can see working but only if the AoE radius is really small and the duration of Hastega isn't quite as long as Haste. Anyway if you put this in you would have to call it something else since Garuda's already got Hastega.

Demi can be included but I think that instead of the standard percentage based Demi it should be just a Dark element nuke. Think of it as the polar opposite of Banish.

[Shalababala]

Maybe for the time mage 2 hour ability, you could reset someone else's 2 hour? It's not too overpowering that way, because someone is going to use the ability, but you have the choice of who you want to give it to again depending on the situation.

These threads are really interesting, thanks for keeping me unbored at work ^^d

[Kalledon]

It should be noted that my original post has been editted to reflect suggestions made here and in other forums I've posted this.

[Macht]

Originally posted by Shalababala
Maybe for the time mage 2 hour ability, you could reset someone else's 2 hour? It's not too overpowering that way, because someone is going to use the ability, but you have the choice of who you want to give it to again depending on the situation.

These threads are really interesting, thanks for keeping me unbored at work ^^d

Actually that could be overpowering, have a Time Mage reset a SMN, RNG, RDM, DRK (with Kraken Club), or maybe even a WAR and it's just way overboard in damage ability you give those jobs. Not to mention I could just see Time Mages offering a reset to a players 2hr for money.

I still have a hard time seeing Time Mage work or work anywere near it's intention.

In defense to the percent base damage reductions I don't see why it would be a problem to make them auto-resisted to those strong monsters. That was their basic design on the big bosses on previous games percent based damage spells were basically useless against them, you could cast it 50 times and MAYBE get 1 to hit.

[Kalledon]

In defense to the percent base damage reductions I don't see why it would be a problem to make them auto-resisted to those strong monsters. That was their basic design on the big bosses on previous games percent based damage spells were basically useless against them, you could cast it 50 times and MAYBE get 1 to hit. [/B]

Yeah, everyone seems to forget this and immediately assumes the ability would be overpowered.

[Altae]

Originally posted by Ghostraven
I really don't think you can have a %based damage spell in this game.

4 timemages casting Demi I = the chance to oneshot an EXP mob.
That's overpowered.

The only way I see Demi in this game is as an ancient magic that uses ubsurd amounts of MP and an insane recast time.
Even then what's to stop Timemage alliances from trying to oneshot HNM's/Gods?

Quoting the underlined part. Well, to fix that, you could make it so the fraction of HP that's reduced from Demi is less than 1/4. Technically Demi minus 1/4 of the monster's current HP. So, why not make the fractional minus a 1/8? Or 1/6? Something that'll help to keep the fight dragged out more. Also using mp faster and waiting for recasts. The only downside is a RDM subbing this job and using Chainspell. But even that can be altered for a "repaired" effect. Just make it so Demi isn't accessible until level 38 or higher.

And couldn't Time Mages supposedly cast a variant form of protect/shell? For example: Reflect, Barrier, M Barrier, Wall. (i.e FF7^^) This can really help on things like Sandy Dynamis. When the Dynamis mob SMNers use their astral flow and deal 2000 damage to the entire alliance. And imagine all the fun you can have with reflect.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

( Edit: And to clarify something else:

Originally posted by Kalledon
Okay, maybe I didn't clarify Demi well enough. It's strictly a damage skill with no percentage. It's figured out by taking the Time Mages Int and Temporal skill and comparing to a mob's Temporal defense.

Quarter is the percentage spell and you only get a 25% damage that does not necessarilly succeed. On the concern that this would allow 4 TIM's to one shot a mob it wouldn't work. Assuming they all actually got the spell off, it would go 25% leaving 75% of the mobs hp then take another 25% leaving it with 56% of its hp then the 3rd 25% leavign the mob with 42% of it's hp, and then the 4th leaving the mob with 32% of it's total hp. And that is assuming they all went off and didn't get resisted.

I don't know what bootlegged versions of FF games you've played, but the norm is that Demi minuses a percentage of HP of the enemy's current HP. Lets pretend Demi is a spell that always minuses 1/4 the current HP. So the enemy starts with 200HP, you cast Demi. Minusing 1/4 of 200 becomes 150. Cast Demi again. The current HP of the enemy has changed now, so you're minusing 1/4 of 150. Thus changing the number to 37.5. So the enemy's HP could now be 37 or 38. And Demi will continue to minus HP until the mob's remaining HP is 1. Demi isn't a set damage. I've never seen it always do 1000 damage or whatever set variable you claim it to be.

And to comment on the first post of this thread. The list of magic available to the Time Mage, as they progress in levels, is quite much. Think about what your magic menu/list will look like. With more than 40 spells. Infact, the spell progressions looks to be every other level. Indeed this job is too strong.

And for your information, the real Altae didn't add the info about the Time Mages Demi ability or spell list in this post. Courtesy of her BF James. She did however mention the idea about Barrier and reflect. Just laying out proper credit. Thank you for your time. )

[Kalledon]

Originally posted by Altae
I don't know what bootlegged versions of FF games you've played, but the norm is that Demi minuses a percentage of HP of the enemy's current HP. Lets pretend Demi is a spell that always minuses 1/4 the current HP. So the enemy starts with 200HP, you cast Demi. Minusing 1/4 of 200 becomes 150. Cast Demi again. The current HP of the enemy has changed now, so you're minusing 1/4 of 150. Thus changing the number to 37.5. So the enemy's HP could now be 37 or 38. And Demi will continue to minus HP until the mob's remaining HP is 1. Demi isn't a set damage. I've never seen it always do 1000 damage or whatever set variable you claim it to be. [/B]

I am well aware of this. But as many people have pointed out, Demi would then be overpowered. So I have it as a regular attack spell instead of a %based one and just made Quarter (which is an actual spell from FF6 and one other I can't remember) to be the % spell that you only get 1 of.

[yuukei]

If you look at most spells lists a number of spells are grouped together in the same level with noticeble gaps in levels until you get anything new. I don't think having spells every other level makes this job any more powerful than any other job. The number of total spells is still relatively the same, it's just spread out more evenly. In any event, if you're wanting to make it more "authentic" however, you'd want to have some gaps in between levels.

And just to reiterate, Kalledon's information on Demi wasn't something he was claiming to be from other FF games. He modified how it worked so it wouldn't be overpowered. Please read thoroughly before trying to slam someone.

One thing I wanna pick at is the spells Age and Youthen. That's kinda abusive. You could have a party fight a mob that's like T or VT for an easy battle, and then cast Age and get IT exp. It'll be way too easy to make those chain 6s and 7s. I'm not particularly fond of those 2 spells, although I understand you're trying to do something that helps define Time Mage.

[LadyPeorth]

Originally posted by Kalledon
New Spells:
Demi, Demi II, Demi III, Demi IV, Demiga, Demiga II, Demiga III – basic temporal attack spells--deals temporal damage; using gravity and temporal manipulations, the Time Mage bends his enemies’ body causing damage (note. This is not the tradition Demi in that it does 25% of a mobs hp--see Quarter. This is basically the same as Fire, Stone, Water, etc only it is Temporal based instead of elemental)

Step by step analysis...here we go. Adding in a new magical based property really REALLY needs backstory, and other new things (perhaps icon changes, a new avatar, how good are other mages at casting time magic?). You also don't liste what stat Temporal spells use. While not totally important...more details help people understand your vision.

Quarter - Temporal attack spell that deals damage equal to 25% of the mob's remaining hp. Has a low chance of success and a long casting time.

Everyone's already been over it.

Meteor, Meteo – powerful temporal attack spells (Meteor-single enemy, Meteo-AoE)

No Qualms again

Stop, Stop II – enfeebling spell that halts an enemy for a certain period of time preventing it from performing any actions (Stop would have a medium to high chance of success but only a low amount of time actually affecting the mob, maybe only 5-10 seconds; Stop II would last longer but have a much lower chance of success) Unlike stun which completely kills an enemy action, Stop only prevents the action from continuing. Once stop wears of the mob continues on as if nothing happened (ie. If a mob starts casting a spell and you cast stop on it the spell timer freezes in the middle and picks up again when the spell wears off).

I think Delay would be a better name...though you are keeping with FF lore. Basically...it's like Stun, only doesn't truly stop the current motion. The mob just sits there and gets wailed on. Even if it is 5-10 seconds for level 1 version, 5-10 seconds is a lot longer time then people expect.

Blur, Blur II, Bluraga, Bluraga II - increases evasion of target/party (names subject to better suggestion)

Makes a ninja tank better

MHaste, MHaste II - increase casting speed or decreases casting time depending on how you look at it

How much are we looking at? Fast Cast bonus? Fast Cast 2 Bonus? This would probably stack with Fast Cast so would it allow for a RDM to achieve perma Chainspell? Could be very powerful

Age - increases the mobs level by 1*
Age II - increases the mobs level by 5*
Youthen - decreases the mobs level by 1*
Youthen II - decreases the mobs level by 5*
*If caster loses claim to this mob then the spell wears off. Does not work on NM's

Okay...you do realize how this would work. Widdle the mob down to a sliver of health, cast Bio II on it, have Time mage spage Age 2. Or perhaps sleep a mob, spam Youthen 2, smack him once down to half health, sleep again, spam Age 2.

Rewind - When cast on a player it shows up as a buff on that player and when it wears off (after say 10 seconds) the players stats are reset to what they were when the buff took effect. Wouldn't work if player died or if the buff was dispelled.

Because the duration is so short...I don't see any use for this spell at all.

Float, Float II - increases resistance to Earth based spells

So now Titan is even more of a push over? Carol, BarEarth, and Float and then just whack away at him. Stone IV would do all of 100 damage.

Quicken - allows target's next ability/spell to ignore any cooldown timers or casting time. This does not work on 2hr abilities and it has a very long recast timer of it's own.

While 2hr abilities are the first thought up...think about SMN Bloodpacts. Fire off 2 Eclipse Bites in a row. Faster Barrages would make an Arrow Burn party much better. Hafta be a pretty long recast timer.

Hastega, Slowega, Graviga, Haste II, Slow II, Gravity II – stronger or AoE versions of existing spells.

No Qualms

Job Abilities
Lv1: X-Zone
Effect: The Time Mage casts an enemy mob into another dimension for a certain period of time or possibly even killing it. (Depending on the mob’s difficulty would equal how long it stays in there. A easy or not worth it mob would die instantly, a decent challenge would go in for say 30 seconds, an even match would go for 25, tough for 20, very tough for 15, incredibly tough for 10, and anything higher for 5; also depending on how long its in there = how much damage it receives).
Recast: 2 hours.

So like EES...but over time. Utterly worthless on higher level mobs unless the damage is intense. 1 shotting an EP...while fun, does not justify this. Also if a DC is in 30 seconds, that means the damage can't be that impressive if it i lives. Can the monster be hurt while in the X-Zone? Do enfeebles carry over?

Lv15: Cosmic Seal
Effect: Makes the next Temporal spell double in power.
Duration: 1 spell cast. Lasts 30 seconds after cast.
Recast: 15 minutes.

Quarter becomes Half. Besides that, it's alright

Lvl40: Mirror Image
Effect: Greatly increases the Time Mage's evasion by making the mob see multiple versions of himself.
Duration: 1 minute
Recast: 5 minutes

For farming only I take it?

Job Traits
Lv10: Slow Resistance
Effect: Slightly increases resistance to slow spells.

Lvl15: Bind Resistance
Effect: Slightly increases resistance to being bound.

Lv25: Temporal Defense
Effect: Increases defense against temporal spells (no reason to think mobs wouldn’t get them also).

Lv35: Auto Haste
Effect: Slightly increases attack speed.

Lvl40: Slow Resistance II
Effect: Further increases resistance to slow spells.

Lvl45: Bind Resistance II
Effect: Further increases resistance to being bound.

Lv50: Temporal Defense II
Effect: Further increases defense against temporal spells.

Lvl60: Auto Haste II
Effect: Further increases attack speed.

No real beefs

[Kalledon]

Modified the Age/Youthen spells so that they must be cast before a mob takes damage. This way you can't use it to get easy xp but instead use it to find a mob that is the level you want to fight (at low lvl soloing you can youthen to make the mob easier and when partying you can age to find more IT mobs).

[kuu]

It's call curse. Trying to diversify something only gets you existing spells.

[Kalledon]

It's call curse. Trying to diversify something only gets you existing spells.

I'm not exactly sure what you are talking about here