HNMs

[Coinspinner]

So I've killed a few baby HNMs now. Tapping my Stun macro for three hours hoping the (confirmed) gil seller group doesn't claim it just is not my idea of 'fun'. Seeing those Chinese ****ers claim it I realized I can't think of anything dropped from an HNM that I actually want.

Serket Ring: Don't care much about MP, but there's plenty of WHM and RDM around who do.
Vivian Ring: See above, but with a much tougher NM and a lower drop rate.
Abjurations: Not impressed.
Kirin's Pole: If I still have a reason to melee at that point, yay. Just have to lot against any Monks present since they get more utility out of it. ><;

Equipment I'm aiming at:
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?21692

With all HQ staves except Apollo's and Pluto's.

If I ever have the luck to find myself in a good Dynamis LS I might have a few usefull AF2 pieces to show for it once day. The boots and pants seem great, not too interested in the rest but they're rare anyway. But I'm not counting on it.

IS there any reason for us to bother with HNMs? Besides getting enough raw gil to purchase items that actually mean something to us I mean.

[kazuri]

Well, first off, I'll argue with your 'IS there any reason for us to bother with HNMs?'. This is my opinion, but I think of HNM Linkshells as a fun thing with friends and people you're close with, not just a use of means to get some super cool gear and such. So, I'd say yes, there's plenty of reasons for us to do HNM activities.

Now I'll argue with points from equipment. No offense, but you don't think Abjurations are good? Not sure what your meaning of impressed means, but hell I think MG ATK+5 from Mitts can be more helpful then Elemental Skill+15 or MB+ at times, etc.

blah not enough items I can think of / reasons to back up but anyways here's a post.

[AtraposBLM]

Originally posted by Coinspinner
So I've killed a few baby HNMs now. Tapping my Stun macro for three hours hoping the (confirmed) gil seller group doesn't claim it just is not my idea of 'fun'. Seeing those Chinese ****ers claim it I realized I can't think of anything dropped from an HNM that I actually want.

Serket Ring: Don't care much about MP, but there's plenty of WHM and RDM around who do.
Vivian Ring: See above, but with a much tougher NM and a lower drop rate.
Abjurations: Not impressed.
Kirin's Pole: If I still have a reason to melee at that point, yay. Just have to lot against any Monks present since they get more utility out of it. ><;

Equipment I'm aiming at:
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?21692

With all HQ staves except Apollo's and Pluto's.

If I ever have the luck to find myself in a good Dynamis LS I might have a few usefull AF2 pieces to show for it once day. The boots and pants seem great, not too interested in the rest but they're rare anyway. But I'm not counting on it.

IS there any reason for us to bother with HNMs? Besides getting enough raw gil to purchase items that actually mean something to us I mean.

Exactly.

However, at the same time, HNM groups are not just about getting gear and loot. They can also be about having fun with your friends, and helping your friends get the gear they want. It's also the place where the *majority* of the high levels go - if you need to do something that requires high levels, you're pretty much assured of getting it done with an HNM ls. Meaning:

Remember that Sleepga II mob? He's a joke now if you get a group of 75's together.

Phantom Worm giving you trouble? Lots of people that could potentially help.

Coffer camp for 2nd jobs? Hell, most of the people in my HNM have 2-3 jobs 50+ (in addition to their lv75 main), so they'll be right along with you.

BC70's for gil? Look no further.

etc.

Mainly, though, the things I could *get* from an HNM LS are limited to the following:

Abyssal Earring (AABCNM, almost impossible to do without at least a majority of players from your HNM LS) - Check
Dragon Talon -> Igquirra Weskit - Pending
Zenith Pumps - Pending (+2 int and +50 mp on shoes is incredible)
Zenith Mitts - Debateable whether to bother with this, but hey, if I got a pair of cursed Mitts I wouldn't complain.


Certainly less than other jobs stand to benefit, but I personally join simply for the fun of hanging out with people I like, and who are my level. It gets old after a while to be 70+ and be in a LS that's primarily in mid game (40-60ish) unless you've known them all for a long time. Even then, it's nice to get into an LS where everyone knows what it takes to get to end game, what's involved, and generally just know's their shit. I keep my pearl from the first LS I ever joined, and I use it to keep up to date with old friends, but I was never really able to do much with that LS. A chat-ls just simply doesn't work well in this game for getting events done because the level spread just gets nuts. HNM LS you're guarenteed to be 65+ - that's the reason to join. You'd be surprised what kind of fun/mayham you can have in this game when you get a bunch of high level people running around.

[Nodoka]

AF2 Shoes > Zenith Pumps

First off, the both have 2 INT on them. Although the AF only have 18 MP on it, it has Conserve MP+5, and enmity-1. The enmity-1 isn't anything super fantastic, but the littlest of enmity on various gear add up. Now there's a 32 MP difference. Having used the Igquira body with only Conserve MP+2, I've seen a bit of an improvement with its frequency to reduce MP cost on various spells (I always switch to it when D2ing and I see it kicking in a bit more often). However if you had the AF2 boots, I dont see why having just extra MP is better. Hell, even if your Thunder4 went from 171 MP -> 150 MP or so, you just saved the amount of MP you would have had with the Zenith. And this shoes alot more if you used alot of smaller spells with all your MP instead of a few really big ones. Lots of MP is great, but if you can conserve mp on at least 1 big spell before healing (which is very likely) then you just saved the difference between the Zenith compared to AFs MP.

So in conclusion, more Conserve MP = More Gooder.

[Coinspinner]

Originally posted by kazuri
This is my opinion, but I think of HNM Linkshells as a fun thing with friends and people you're close with, not just a use of means to get some super cool gear and such.

/nod

That's why I joined my current LS. Fun people to be around. Shame the HNM fights I've done weren't really "fun"...
Originally posted by kazuri
Now I'll argue with points from equipment. No offense, but you don't think Abjurations are good? Not sure what your meaning of impressed means, but hell I think MG ATK+5 from Mitts can be more helpful then Elemental Skill+15 or MB+ at times, etc.

I am pretty much sick of equipment swap macros. I'm not a huge fan of -Enmity, though I see now it does make a difference. Zenith doesn't have any... so I'll take the AF hands and hat over Zenith. The rest... feh. Don't need a Refresh body piece, I have the Black Cloak if I really need Refresh. Slacks are ok for MP swap, but remember, as a Mithra I have a set of red panties with +32 MP already (-50 Pervert resistance though...), +50 MP is not such an improvement for me. Feet... I like River Gaiters or AFII better.

Originally posted by AtraposBLM
However, at the same time, HNM groups are not just about getting gear and loot. They can also be about having fun with your friends, and helping your friends get the gear they want. It's also the place where the *majority* of the high levels go - if you need to do something that requires high levels, you're pretty much assured of getting it done with an HNM ls.

/nod

Again, I don't regret joining and I'm not thinking of leaving, I enjoy helping out, but competing with other shells (or worse, the gil sellers ><;) takes some of the fun out. I'm just disapointed that there are precious few "prestige" items for BLM outside of Dynamis. We get some fantastic items, but most of them are salable... you can get them chopping wood, or fishing, or hitting things with a stick.


Originally posted by AtraposBLM
Certainly less than other jobs stand to benefit, but I personally join simply for the fun of hanging out with people I like, and who are my level. It gets old after a while to be 70+ and be in a LS that's primarily in mid game (40-60ish) unless you've known them all for a long time. Even then, it's nice to get into an LS where everyone knows what it takes to get to end game, what's involved, and generally just know's their shit. I keep my pearl from the first LS I ever joined, and I use it to keep up to date with old friends, but I was never really able to do much with that LS. A chat-ls just simply doesn't work well in this game for getting events done because the level spread just gets nuts. HNM LS you're guarenteed to be 65+ - that's the reason to join. You'd be surprised what kind of fun/mayham you can have in this game when you get a bunch of high level people running around.

Oh yes... my first LS was great for chat, but getting help was impossible. In my 30s we had a pool of 4 people (out of about 30) available for RSE keys and Adv. Job quests, ditto in the 50s for Genkai and AF keys. Once the highest members cleared one hurdle the stragglers would demand their help with the same. ><;

...actually it's the same thing now with the RotZ and CoP missions. Oh well.. at least the RotZ content is still roughly in everyone's level range.

[AtraposBLM]

Originally posted by Nodoka
AF2 Shoes > Zenith Pumps

First off, the both have 2 INT on them. Although the AF only have 18 MP on it, it has Conserve MP+5, and enmity-1. The enmity-1 isn't anything super fantastic, but the littlest of enmity on various gear add up. Now there's a 32 MP difference. Having used the Igquira body with only Conserve MP+2, I've seen a bit of an improvement with its frequency to reduce MP cost on various spells (I always switch to it when D2ing and I see it kicking in a bit more often). However if you had the AF2 boots, I dont see why having just extra MP is better. Hell, even if your Thunder4 went from 171 MP -> 150 MP or so, you just saved the amount of MP you would have had with the Zenith. And this shoes alot more if you used alot of smaller spells with all your MP instead of a few really big ones. Lots of MP is great, but if you can conserve mp on at least 1 big spell before healing (which is very likely) then you just saved the difference between the Zenith compared to AFs MP.

So in conclusion, more Conserve MP = More Gooder.

Yes...however, one of those I can see myself getting (Zenith Pumps). One of those, I can't imagine I'd be lucky enough to get(AF2). So I try to keep my dreaming reasonable. ^^;

[Thegod]

coin, this is a question only you can answer.

recently (last night in particular) My LS and a bunch of friends have been begging me to go back to rng, they say i shouldnt waste my time leveling BLM when for a mithra a ranger is the best i could do, and with rng already at level 40, i just have the fun stuff to look forward to (boy*cough* girl scout looking AF pieces, sidewinder, and ummm yeah sidewinder)

my question, and its very inportant coin, please be honest.


can a mithra excell in HNM LS at level 75? or will i always be gimped to the tarus due to low MP?

i guess the same could be said about every non taru race, and from 1-54 BLM race hasnt been an issue yet, but now i see elvaan blms at my level who are really frustraited because of the lack of MP, will my mithra ever reach this point?


oh and im still going with the spells>>>gear thing, but my gear is very good, just picked up desert stone i dunno if i already posted that....lol

[Gavin]

Lv 70+ there is not much difference, there is so much +mp gear out there, I am sure you'll be just fine heh.

[Thegod]

Originally posted by Gavin
Lv 70+ there is not much difference, there is so much +mp gear out there, I am sure you'll be just fine heh.

yeah talked to some RL friends dunno why i didnt concider this untill last night the elvaan seemed so irritated at his natural mp.

i dont wanna sub out any int whatsoever for MP, so whatever +mp my gear can give me w/o taking away any int thats what i'll go for...thnx btw.

[Coinspinner]

Originally posted by Thegod
coin, this is a question only you can answer.

recently (last night in particular) My LS and a bunch of friends have been begging me to go back to rng, they say i shouldnt waste my time leveling BLM when for a mithra a ranger is the best i could do, and with rng already at level 40, i just have the fun stuff to look forward to (boy*cough* girl scout looking AF pieces, sidewinder, and ummm yeah sidewinder)

RNG is the best class for damage dealing for every race. But the whole "You should be a RNG because you are Mithra!" sounds newbish to me. (Not calling anyone a newb here.) Black Mage can do a lot more than damage, which is what keeps it interesting for me.

Originally posted by Thegod
my question, and its very inportant coin, please be honest.


can a mithra excell in HNM LS at level 75? or will i always be gimped to the tarus due to low MP?

1: As BLM? Yes.
2: You will always be weaker, but far from 'gimp'. This is the price you pay to not look like a Cabbage Patch doll. When you inevitably pull hate, your odds of survivbaly are marginally better, if that's any consolation.

Originally posted by Thegod
i guess the same could be said about every non taru race, and from 1-54 BLM race hasnt been an issue yet, but now i see elvaan blms at my level who are really frustraited because of the lack of MP, will my mithra ever reach this point?

( I don't know how to answer that question. ) Frustration is a personal thing. Some people might get frustrated seeing their MP dip below 100, even if it's after Chain 5, where you have the option to sit untill MP is full during the next battle. I only ever get frustrated when soloing, something BLM don't often do, and realize that with another 200 MP (roughly what Taru have on us at 68) I could kill it without needing to Sleep and rest. ><;

[Sadeira]

dalmatica *cough*

having refresh WHILE you can wear your hat?! that's awesome!

[Coinspinner]

Originally posted by Sadeira
dalmatica *cough*

having refresh WHILE you can wear your hat?! that's awesome!

Such a pain in the butt to get though. It's those souped up versions of Behemoth, Fafnir and Adamantoise that drop those abjurations iirc. ><;

Point I guess, because you get the MP with less item switching. But it's not as for us good as it is for BRD, SMN, WHM and RDM.

Heh, RDM can get another refresh on their hat slot via AFII, for a constant 2 per tick ^^;

[AtraposBLM]

Originally posted by Coinspinner
Such a pain in the butt to get though. It's those souped up versions of Behemoth, Fafnir and Adamantoise that drop those abjurations iirc. ><;

Point I guess, because you get the MP with less item switching. But it's not as for us good as it is for BRD, SMN, WHM and RDM.

Heh, RDM can get another refresh on their hat slot via AFII, for a constant 2 per tick ^^;

They can sub smn and have a natural perma-refresh. o.o

[Sadeira]

*sigh* i know it'll never happen for me ; ;

[Thegod]

naw i realized that in a good solid party where all six members are performing well, my MP is not even close to an issue.

In a JP party last night (i really dont like em because i have to be quiet the whole time, witch isnt a problem because i usually dont chat, but every now and again its nice to be able to communicate with the people you are spending 3-4 hours with.)


anyway i only have like 570 max mp with melon pies but with the rest macro and the 3 MP regen up while healing items MP isnt usually a problem, plus emergencys dont usualy happen more then once every 2 hours, so mana can get me out of any trouble we might find.


Oh and yeah I couldnt be a taru, they are too small, they are swift dont get me wrong, i love partying with tarus, in fact i'd prefer all my mages to be tarus, but hey they are small....lol

and they dont look as swift as my mithra with a scythe equiped..lol

[Arturo-B]

Originally posted by Thegod


can a mithra excell in HNM LS at level 75? or will i always be gimped to the tarus due to low MP?


I wouldn't worry about this at all. At endgame race is really a non issue. If you know how to play, are a relatively nice person, and have at least adequate gear you'll go far.

And 3 cheers for atrapos' post. I'm having the best time I've ever had ingame hunting hnm with nice people. There's very little gear I wanted endgame either, as I'm fortunate enough crafting to be able to buy what I need, but it's still a blast fighting with 18-20+ people. And it's not just hnm. Ranks, cop etc, are great with a group of like minded and levelled people.

[Thegod]

Yeah i had planned to stop BLM at 60 for some lame arse reason, but after going to the snoy xarcsomething or other i have decided to stick it out with BLM (i love this job)

...but yeah the idea of walking around that area aggro free is just great, so 75 here i come...

Oh i hate missions and quest and all that bs, but only because i've never been strong enough to go into any areas w/o sneak/invis constantly up, so once i can freely roam those things are gonna be way more fun