Level 75 PLD vs. DRK 1on1 In Ballista

[Sesci]

Level 75 PLD vs. DRK 1on1 In Ballista
--
My LS brought up this idea the other day and suprisingly, had support on both sides. After looking at all of the advantages at both jobs(no sub-job abilities) We see that...
PLD:

Flash
Curing
Protect / Shell
Sentinel
Shield Bash
-
DRK:

Soul Eater
Last Resort
Black Magic (Drain / Aspir VERY useful)
Weapon Bash

In looking at these abilities, both sides have their obvious advantages in different fields. PLDs have high defense, helping them take damage, and DRKs have high attack, helping them give it. When looking at two hours, PLD comes out winning on this one. Invincible cancels out Blood Weapon, with the TP to show for it. Now for some Pro's and Con's.

PLD Pros:
Curing - Nothing like throwing a Cure IV during a correctly timed attack interval.
Protect / Shell - Obvious
Sentinel - Can be used to down the damage from Last Resort / Soul Eater
Shield Bash - Can stop various Black Magic abilities including Aspir.
Flash - A well placed Flash after Soul Eater / Last Resort can save a lot of HP

DRK Pros:
Black magic - Enfeebling, and damaging, can be a very useful asset in adding damage to this high def job.
Aspir - Less MP for the PLD to heal, more MP for you to use black magic
Weapon Bash - Stop those pesty Cures
Stun - Look Above
Soul Eater / Last Resort - Enhances Damage
High damage WS's, etc

PLD Cons:
Hits like a wussy
No Aspir, very dependant on MP

DRK Cons:
Takes hits like a wussy
No point in Blood Weapon
No Protect / Shell

Now lets move on to subjobs
So many different strategies can be thought of because of subjobs. With WHM sub, DRKs get Curing, Shell, and Protect, along with enfeebling such as Slow/para/dia, and buffs such as Haste. PLDs get less from the WHM sub, mainly just the enfeebling magic, blink, and Haste. RDM Sub also opens up many possibilities, both jobs could land a Silence to majorly cripple the other. With NIN Sub, both jobs now gain Utsutsemi I and II. SAM sub gives Meditate, not much use there, and DRG sub gives jumps, whoopty doo. There's many advantages to each sub, i'll let you fool around with those ideas.

Lastly, Weapons
Weapons play a major role in this scenario. If PLD were to sub NIN, DRK could use DRK/NIN with Kraken Club and Ridill, which would eat through the Utsutsemi. PLD can switch to Earth Staff at the first sight of Guillotine or during Soul eater / Last resort.

Well that's all the rambling I have now, i'll let you discuss your opinions and hopefully make an interesting debate.

(P.S. I am posting this topic on the PLD Forums as well to have unbiased input.)

[yzfr6]

pld loses.

[Dragon Ghost]

PLD wins <_<

[Zaptruder]

big misconception about plds is that we hit like wussies.

Just wondering how hard a dark will hit when he goes all out on defensive equips and turns on defender.

Not that hard.

That said, Paladin's aren't great dmg dealers... esp against IT mobs... and we have weak WS.

[Dragon Ghost]

They say,if a your VIT is higher then the others STR,they wont hit max,if your DEF is higher then there ATK then you they wont hit max.
You do the math :p

[Gumbercules]

I fought against a taru PLD in ballista yesterday. I had about half HP and he was full, well I managed to stay alive long enough to take down most his health, but he still managed to win. Aspir/Drain are great, and Stun is the best spell you can use to stop them from casting/getting a free hit in. Sure he beat me, but after that I chased him down with Souleater + Guillo :P

[Wings of Icarus]

I saw a 75 PLD vs. 75 DRK /nin subs in ballista.

The PLD won like 4/5 times.

[supertle]

i think it really comes down to the skill of the players and when to use their spells and abilities

[bladecloud]

If the DRK had whm sub, he'd win.


heals - banishga to wipe blinks - slow/para - etc etc.

Add in DRK sleep and Aspir = win.

[ibroyles]

Originally posted by bladecloud
If the DRK had whm sub, he'd win.


heals - banishga to wipe blinks - slow/para - etc etc.

Add in DRK sleep and Aspir = win.

Oh so DRK has to rely on a certain sub to win? Why not consider LV75 PLD vs LV75 DRK no subs for either?

[jmedno5891]

Hmm even though I'm a DRK I'd have to say that I think PLD would probably win. Even though their STR and attack isn't as good as ours their DEF will probably just be too high for us to take them down and with our weak def even their "weak" ws will probably do somewhat good damage on us.:dead:

[Matkun]

I fought a 40 PLD in Ballista, and all she did was slow me down and make a long fight, which I eventually won.

Biggest advantage is if DRK feels he is losing and needs advantage, they can easily Sleep and/or Bind the PLD to get some extra time for recharging or doing what they want.

Don't know 75 vs 75. Ballista is rarely about 1 on 1 fights anyways, so I think it's a moot point.

[Sesci]

One of PLDs extremely useful passive Job traits is Resist Sleep. Sleep wont do much.

[Thelps]

Yeah, I'm probably with the PLD on winning, though it pains me to say it. Drks just hit too slowly to cause consistent damage output, that coupled with a PLD's high Def would make it a losing battle for the DRK. Having said that, a fully TP-charged DRK landing Souleater+Guillotine at the start of the fight would probably turn the tables considerably, but that's a very unlikely situation in Ballista...

As for magic abilities, I'm inclined to believe Cure is more useful than Drain / Aspir, since these abilities are easy to Shield Bash because of their (relatively) long cast times, Cure 1, in particular, while minor, adds up if cast a lot and is practically unstunable, cure 2 I'm sure is freely usable when the DRK's tossed Stun and Weapon Bash and is waiting for cooldown, same for the higher ones.

Kinda sad for us DRKs, but our slow swing rate is almost always our downfall, lol. :rolleyes:

[Bladers]

well, i'm pretty sure pld would win if he is using a staff...for those of you that dont know there is a staff skill called spirit taker that will give plds back a ton of mp. Spirit taker gives them the ability to have so much mp its ridiculous. I've seen a lvl 75 pld solo steelfleece with war sub...a drk/war would no way in hell solo steelfleece.


pld:1 drk:0 ;;

[bladecloud]

DRk's with whm sub are one of the best classes 1vs1 in balista.

Banishga = wipes blink
Heals
Sleep
Aspir
slow
paralyze
drain
absorbs
stun
etc etc



PS. Why would anyone bring WAR or THF sub in a 1vs1 fight?

WHM/NIN/RDM is the way to go for SJ's in ballista.

[Awntawn]

I am never going back to ballista again. Any drunk /nin can recast utsusemi like 358893859280 times in between scythe swings...

[loh989]

Depends on equipment, if you have the right stuff you can do some crazy shizzle.

[kaiserht]

I really wanted to see that match where a DRK/NIN with Ridill and Kraken club went to town against loads of others.

Although i think before we can make any real assumptions, i think that a level 75 PLD should fiht against a level 75 DRK and see what happens.

Still, i think it comes down to playskill and subs rather than equipment.

And just as Awntawn said, anyone can spam Ninja Blink and get away with loads of hits.

[Circlezero]

Keep in mind this doesnt make pld better than drk, and it doesnt mean drk sucks.

[Zafron]

I dont' think anyone would survive fighting 1v1 against someone dual wielding kraken and ridill.

[Kesai]

Originally posted by Awntawn
I am never going back to ballista again. Any drunk /nin can recast utsusemi like 358893859280 times in between scythe swings...

There are lots of ways to get rid of blink or stop someone from casting it (stun). Do it a few times and they will see nothing but numbers counting down the next time they try to cast.

Sneak attack also ignores blink, so run up use sneak attack + spin slash and there shadows won't save them.

Oh regarding pld vs. drk in ballista, what I see all the time is drks using soul eater + guillo on a pld, after that the pld is running or is dead. (esp. the little taru plds that everyone likes to go after

:sweat: )

[Sesci]

"<Name> readies Guillotine."

Sentinel, flash to stop next attack, cure IV

[Thrograth]

Originally posted by Sesci
"<Name> readies Guillotine."

<NamePLD> gains the effect of Silence.
<NamePLD> >>> Cure4
Unable to cast spells right now.

All the mp in the world wont save you now :p

But i dont know, never tried 1v1 against pld, should be a tough one.

Ballista is too much gangrape imo, fun fun smacking a taru one sec, getting smacked by 5 tarus the next.

[Biterman]

<NamePLD>Uses Echo drops. :p

Regarding this, does Guillotine adds Silence effect? And last time I checked you could use medicines and the like in Ballista.

Also you would have to be real lucky or play against a dumb PLD to pull a Sneak + WS. This also means you will have to sub THF. There goes your ability to use shadows, heal yourself or enfeeble.

Remember guys, the discussion is same lvl PLD vs DRK. One on one, mano a mano. To do a Souleater + Guillotine you actually need to get 100% TP. When will you be able to get 100% TP if the PLD subs NIN and is Flashing you every 45 seconds? I suppose you could use an Icarus wing, but that only works every 1-2 hours.

[Kesai]

If you get lucky and quarry up a daedalus (sp?) wing you get 100% tp.

Really the best way to find out is to actually go out and play ballista. On my server hardly any NA's ever show up, maybe 1 or 2 tops everyone else is jpn.

I've seen a 75 drk/thf and a 75 pld/war 1 on 1 before and the drk had no trouble killing the pld.

Frankly in the 60 and no limit cap matches pld's get worked pretty hard by just about every class, just because at that point most everyone has there heavy hitting ws.

In 50 cap pld is very annoying though..takes like 5 ppl to take down a galka pld :biggrin: