Rdm Vs. Ninja (Which one can solo better)

[EtRNaL168]

Well, I am wondering which class can solo more NM or HNM than the other, Rdm or Ninja?

[yuna544]

Well with a sub 75RDM/37NIN is almost unstopable, NIN blink 1 and 2, refresh, stoneskin, phlanx, en spells, gravity etc are very usefull while soloing very hard things ^^;. So not only do you barly get hit with blink but when you do get hit it will be for 0. So bar far RDM/NIN is better then NIn/anything

[EtRNaL168]

haha sweet~ However, I do have a question in mind. When you sub ninja with an intention to use its blink, when do you cast it and how does it work?

For example:

I engage a mob, sleep it, debuff it, and now when I buff myself, does the order of which spell I cast on myself matter? Stoneskin, Phalanx, Blink, Ninja blink, etc., etc.. The question I am trying to give is that Will Ninja's blink always be the first phase of defense that the mob will encounter regardless of the order that utsusemi was casted?

My second question is that when do you refresh all your defensive spells? Do you only refresh it when your stoneskin wears off?

Any inputs to my questions will be greatly appreciated.

Regards,
EtrnaL

[Peltar]

Utsusemi doesn't stack with Blink. You recast any defensive spell when it wears off.

[EtRNaL168]

Ahh.... I think now I understand how to tank as Rdm/Nin.

Throughout the battle, we will be constantly and indefinitely recasting utsusemi as soon as the previous one wears off, and we never planned to tank with Stoneskin and phalanx, they are just there to act as a back up in case Utsusemi gets interrupted. Am I correct?

Regards,
EtrnaL

[Mikasa]

Originally posted by yuna544
Well with a sub 75RDM/37NIN is almost unstopable, NIN blink 1 and 2, refresh, stoneskin, phlanx, en spells, gravity etc are very usefull while soloing very hard things ^^;. So not only do you barly get hit with blink but when you do get hit it will be for 0. So bar far RDM/NIN is better then NIn/anything

In terms of MOBS I would agree with this poster.

However, in terms of PvP there are many ways to defeat the RDM/NIN.

First, any magic user with poison will disrupt your blinks.

Second, RDM/NIN is all defense and no offense. You will be doing very little damage with this combo. Your only damage comes from the III series spells, which have insanely long cast times, and anyone can stop with Stun, Bash etc...

Therefore, jobs like RNG/NIN , BLM/WHM, DRK/WAR , WAR/NIN etc.... will be able to take the "ub3r 133t" RDM/NIN.

[Stormwalker]

The topic, however, was specifically referring to soloing NM's/HNM's.

[yuna544]

Actually RDM alone is the best in Ballista. I "easily" took out a 70RNG as RDM/WHM. The RNG eve had sleep arrows. All I did was Baniuga to get rid of his Blink>Sleep>Water3>Sleep2>Bind>Stone3>Sleep>Water3 then he died :angel: :angel: I mean he gave up. Any melee against a mage doesn't stand a chance really. The only time I died in Ballista is when 4-5 people rushed me :dead: :dead: which wasn't fair.

Originally posted by Mikasa


In terms of MOBS I would agree with this poster.

However, in terms of PvP there are many ways to defeat the RDM/NIN.

First, any magic user with poison will disrupt your blinks.

Second, RDM/NIN is all defense and no offense. You will be doing very little damage with this combo. Your only damage comes from the III series spells, which have insanely long cast times, and anyone can stop with Stun, Bash etc...

Therefore, jobs like RNG/NIN , BLM/WHM, DRK/WAR , WAR/NIN etc.... will be able to take the "ub3r 133t" RDM/NIN.

[Xyphere]

A friend of mine solo'd a Even Match Robber Crab in Kuftal at level 60mor so...(He is a Ninja) there is no way in hell I could do that...on the other hand I did take Goblinsavior Heronox to half HP...

[yuna544]

I solo Tough things for fun:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Ruic]

Can and have soloed Ts and VTs since I started the game as RDM. But I play RDM/WAR and RDM/NIN, so that should be expected. My experience with NIN has been that anything better than DC isn't worth my time to fight solo... Of course my NIN doesn't have Utsusemi: Ni which would be a tremendous boost to solo-ability.

So my answer is both together solo NMs and HNMs the best. RDM/NIN :thumbsup:

[WobbleSiren]

friend of mine solo'd a Even Match Robber Crab in Kuftal at level 60mor so...(He is a Ninja) there is no way in hell I could do that...on the other hand I did take Goblinsavior Heronox to half HP...


I solo crabs in cape terringan for skill up at LV64 rdm/blm. They con T to me...

at LV61 I was soloing EM and T robbers in kuftal for 1k xp > LV62.

Don't think its that difficult at all.

I'm taru but i doubt it makes a difference.


btw: haven't updated my profile in a while.

[Mikasa]

Originally posted by yuna544
Actually RDM alone is the best in Ballista. I "easily" took out a 70RNG as RDM/WHM. The RNG eve had sleep arrows. All I did was Baniuga to get rid of his Blink>Sleep>Water3>Sleep2>Bind>Stone3>Sleep>Water3 then he died :angel: :angel: I mean he gave up. Any melee against a mage doesn't stand a chance really. The only time I died in Ballista is when 4-5 people rushed me :dead: :dead: which wasn't fair.



as a DRK, I can not only Sleep and Bind you, I can also Drain your MP, Absorb-VIT, and watch your HP go into red with one Guillotine.

RDMs are not the best PvP. WAR/NIN is the best PvP post 74.

[Digital]

Originally posted by Mikasa


as a DRK, I can not only Sleep and Bind you, I can also Drain your MP, Absorb-VIT, and watch your HP go into red with one Guillotine.

RDMs are not the best PvP. WAR/NIN is the best PvP post 74.

Not really. Unless the RDM doesn't have blink up, you won't land sleep. And if you use poison, well, now you can't use sleep. Only way I can see you standing a chance is using /WHM, /NIN, or /RDM. Then it's just a matter of who sees who first.

And I don't see how WAR/NIN would have any advantage over RDM, WAR is at a horribly obvious range disadvantage, and WAR/NIN will still have to fight through the RDM's blink while the WAR's is gone in one -ga.

[Mikasa]

Originally posted by Digital


Not really. Unless the RDM doesn't have blink up, you won't land sleep. And if you use poison, well, now you can't use sleep. Only way I can see you standing a chance is using /WHM, /NIN, or /RDM. Then it's just a matter of who sees who first.

And I don't see how WAR/NIN would have any advantage over RDM, WAR is at a horribly obvious range disadvantage, and WAR/NIN will still have to fight through the RDM's blink while the WAR's is gone in one -ga. \

The problem with RDM is that they are all defense and no offense.

Blink, Stoneskin etc.... are all defensive boosts which allow the fight to continue very long against mindless mobs.

However, in a fight, when anyone sees you getting ready for your III series spells, an immediate bash or stun is used. Your Blinks are irrelevant, and can be handled with poisons/regular hits.

The problem RDM has in PvP is that they can't do any damage without their insanely long casting time spells, in which its like they're just saying "OK, here come a big attack now, get ready."

A DRK or WAR on the other hand, can break out a weapon skill that can do 1000 damage with no warning at all.

However, a RDM is perhaps the best job for soloing NMs, no doubt about that.

But RDMs can only do well in Ballista against non-magic users.
Once a RDMs blinks and stoneskin can be taken care of with poison, they are not very good 1vs1.

[Digital]

Originally posted by Mikasa
\

The problem with RDM is that they are all defense and no offense.

Blink, Stoneskin etc.... are all defensive boosts which allow the fight to continue very long against mindless mobs.

However, in a fight, when anyone sees you getting ready for your III series spells, an immediate bash or stun is used. Your Blinks are irrelevant, and can be handled with poisons/regular hits.

The problem RDM has in PvP is that they can't do any damage without their insanely long casting time spells, in which its like they're just saying "OK, here come a big attack now, get ready."

A DRK or WAR on the other hand, can break out a weapon skill that can do 1000 damage with no warning at all.

However, a RDM is perhaps the best job for soloing NMs, no doubt about that.

But RDMs can only do well in Ballista against non-magic users.
Once a RDMs blinks and stoneskin can be taken care of with poison, they are not very good 1vs1.

That's why you put the target to sleep before you cast spells with a long cast time. And unless the RDM is really off his game that WAR or DRK will never be in range for a WS, especially the WAR. And the amount of time between a WAR/NINs hits and a DRKs are plenty of time to sleep and run. And even if we are poisoned, the only way you can keep us still is bind, and you can easily be slept by the time you make it to the RDM.

[Apple Pie]

1,000 dmg with Guillotine?

Hmm... I've never seen it although I've joined in Ballista a lot of times. There are a lot of, what we call, "Haijin (廃人)" with gourgeous gears here on Gilgamesh but the highest dmg I [LV65 RDM] got from DRK75's Guillotine was only 458 dmg. Not enough to kill a tiny taru RDM.

As far as I know, there's almost none of them using Scythe. Almost all of them sub NIN and equip either 1H sword + 1H axe or 1H axe + 1H axe. Rampage and Vorpal Blade with dual wielding are common weapon skills and they seem to do better than Guillotine according to my experience.

Well, 1 on 1 duel don't usually happen because it's a group fight. However, smart RDMs never allow enemies to come close. Check what two spells commonly used are.

[Mikasa]

Originally posted by Digital


That's why you put the target to sleep before you cast spells with a long cast time. And unless the RDM is really off his game that WAR or DRK will never be in range for a WS, especially the WAR. And the amount of time between a WAR/NINs hits and a DRKs are plenty of time to sleep and run. And even if we are poisoned, the only way you can keep us still is bind, and you can easily be slept by the time you make it to the RDM.

what you keep forgetting is that DRKs not only have sleep and bind, but Stun as well.

You keep thinking you are the only ones with sleep and bind.

So then it becomes a battle of sleep+bind+attack until someone wears the other person down.

Perhaps after you level up some more you will understand what
I'm saying.

[Digital]

Originally posted by Mikasa


what you keep forgetting is that DRKs not only have sleep and bind, but Stun as well.

You keep thinking you are the only ones with sleep and bind.

So then it becomes a battle of sleep+bind+attack until someone wears the other person down.

Perhaps after you level up some more you will understand what
I'm saying.

Oh, you showed me, I'm not as high as you, so I must be wrong.

Listen, and maybe you'll learn. Whatever you decide to cast first, I don't care what it is, will be blinked away. And if you use poison to get rid of blink, well, now you can't sleep the RDM. After your spell is blinked away, its as simple as sleeping you before you get the chance to sleep us. And while you're talking about what people forgot, how about you remember the spell Silence. Now you're not only getting nuked and then slept right after, you're bound in place and can't retaliate with any sort of magic.

[Apple Pie]

The problem RDM has in PvP is that they can't do any damage without their insanely long casting time spells, in which its like they're just saying "OK, here come a big attack now, get ready."
Well, how long do you think it takes LV75 RDM with Warlock's Chapeau to cast Thunder III? It's only 5.4 seconds and 3.15 seconds faster than one swing of Death Sythe +1. That's why there's almost no dark knights with Sythe as I mentioned because if you use Sythe, you just give mages free chances to nuke. You should know even RDM's C+ rated elemental spells are hardly resisted against those at the same LV unless they have corresponding Bar- spells/Carol songs or boost their elemental resists with their gears.

Then, how long it takes you to reuse Weapon Bash or recast Stun? It takes 300 seconds and 45 seconds respectively. How many times do you think RDM can nuke then? Only a set of Thunder III, Blizzard III, and Fire III is enough to do 1,100+ damage in 15.2 seconds.

In addition, how long does it take for poison II to remove RDM's stoneskin that absorbs around 300 damage? Do you really know the highest slip damage of RDM with 298 enfeebling skill (slip damage is dependent on enfeebling skill.)? It's only 10HP/3sec and the effect only lasts 120 seconds. You should know LV75 RDM with the hat can recast stoneskin in 8 seconds and it's going to be 6 or 7 seconds with Haste on. When you do 0 damage because of stoneskin, you have no chance to build your TP. Drain absorbs 0HP.

As for Stun, 74 RDM/37 DRK has 9 seconds shorter (36 seconds) recasting time than that of 75 DRK due to "Fast Recast" ability (Fast Cast now affects recasting timer) and it can be 12 seconds shorter with Haste.

BTW, the most effective spell used on caster vs caster duel is, with no doubt, Silence. We hardly have chances to duel between casters but when it happens, we keep casting it until they use up all their Echo Drops. That's a dirty tactic and I don't usually do this unless they try to do it to me. I usually bring two dozens of Echo Drops but sometimes they are not enough.

Finally, I'm not trying to compare dark knights to red mages at all because our primary jobs in Ballista are different but what you stated above sounds like you know nothing of us. We're not what you've been seeing in your XP PT.

There are a lot of things we can do in Ballista and this is the real place we show our versatility. We can choose whatever sub-jobs we like depending on what we do. You know we can even do 600+ damage with RDM/RNG, Sidewinder + Barrage. It hardly misses targets although we have "D" for our Bow skill.

Anyway, we should stop talking something like, "which is stronger?" anymore.

[Apple Pie]

Oh, I forgot to say one thing.

Killing people isn't what we are only supposed to do over there. We have to get marks! If we're standing within 30m (how many feets?) from those who defeat our oponent, we're also in the state of "Gate Breach."

The problem of San d'Oria in Gilgamesh is there are a lot of frontliners only concentrating on killing others... We lack both BLM and RDM. The ratio between melee and caster is something like 7:3 compared to 5:5 of Bastok and 4:6 of Windurst.

Windurst is the strongest and we're the weakest. O.......rz We know why...

[Deodorant]

Mikasa is one of those typical stubborn, elvaan, 'my drk is better than you, whatever you say is pointless because I won't listen' people :zzz: If I were you I'd just ignore his ironic and ignorant posts :thumbsup:

[Apple Pie]

Oh, I didn't know that... ＿|￣|○

So sounds like I should take another movie in Ballista ^^; It may be a little hard since it's very laggy. Well, the problem is by the time I ask them to duel, I've been chased by a lot of Elvaans and Galkas ;_;

I'll stop posting on this thread anyway.

[Mikasa]

Originally posted by Deodorant
Mikasa is one of those typical stubborn, elvaan, 'my drk is better than you, whatever you say is pointless because I won't listen' people :zzz: If I were you I'd just ignore his ironic and ignorant posts :thumbsup:

"Thank you for reporting that post. It will be dealt with in an appropriate manner."

[Patchinko]

Doesn't high MND influence sleep resist (or is that INT...)? If so, I'd imagine Sleep from someone of the same lvl would be kind of hit or miss against a well equipped RDM unless the DRK has a lot of INT+ gear.

In addition, it's nothing a Poison Potion won't "cure," right? It may sound strange, but capless Ballista inventories are filled with Echo Drops, Poison Potions, Icarus Wings and so forth, as I understand it. Would make it far more interesting at least.^^

I haven't done Ballista, but I'm considering joining in on a 50 cap.

Grendel>> Do you have a video of you in Ballista?

[EtRNaL168]

LoLz... _(._.)_ can we stay on topic please? ^^"

-Etrnal

[DrSerpico]

Oh my mikasa, she critizised you, better report her FAST!

Have you ever been in ballista or even SEEN a lengthy video of what is happening? if your levels are even close to eachother, sleep lands. I land debuffs reliably as soon as the mob slips from IT to VT. Against EM I can pick anything I want and land it.

So the thing is, to land stuff, you have to deblink the target. Deblinking it is done by fast repetitive attacks (mnk, definately NOT drk) or -ga line spells. Drk most oftenly use poisonga to deblink. The cast time for rdm on poisonga, should he choose to use it, is ALWAYS 40% faster than yours.

Now you'r deblinked before he is, and he's already casting sleep. Sorry to say, you won't have enough time to stun before you're sound asleep.

The way ballista works is blm, rng and rdm mainly, not exclusively though, disable a target... THEN the heavy hitters take their shot. Drk, rng, blm. Or while you're asleep, how about sneak+dragonkick from behind? Bind and sleep. Those and the shadow games are what ballista is about.

So theorize how much you want. Report anyone who disagrees. It's still all about bind, sleep and blink. And fast cast puts you behind. Thoughts or comments?

[Sindinista]

This reminds me of a little competition me and a friend were talkinb about having. RDM/BLM versus WAR/NIN. Now of course I would absolutely destroy him, that's not my question. I was wondering, does Dispel work on Utusemi?

[Chucklez_1]

Nah I don't think so. While camping ninja birds for coffer keys long time ago, I used to cast dispel to remove utsusemi w/o any luck at all. Might be different for ballista.

As for rdms in ballista...no one really talked about gravity :( sure Sleep is the preferale choice...but not when their Doted by some dude using diaga or poisonga. When all else fails...Gravity is your friend :thumbsup: except for sneaky rangers :mad:

[Apple Pie]

Check what two spells commonly used are.
Quoting what I said on this thread, they are Bind and Glavity as a matter of fact.

On Ballista matches with no LV restriction, most of them use poison portions and Sleep spells are not always mighty. However, even LV65 RDM's Bind and Glavity are hardly resisted by LV75 players.

Bind / Glavity -> Gang-bang. This is the basic tactic.

As for dispeling Utsusemi, no, it's not a -ga spell and we need to cast it three or four times to remove Utsusemi I or II. ^^;

Patchinko, it is very hard to take movies because of severe lag there. I may be able to go there just as a movie director but I don't want to annoy them...

Well, I'm going to join in the one vs Bastok at 22:33 (JPT) and trying to get one today if I'm able to finish Genkai 4 quest before then. I'm 2,600 xp TNL (LV66) but just found I hadn't finished the quest yet. O...rz

[Karinya]

Originally posted by Sindinista
This reminds me of a little competition me and a friend were talkinb about having. RDM/BLM versus WAR/NIN. Now of course I would absolutely destroy him, that's not my question. I was wondering, does Dispel work on Utusemi?
Well it doesn't work on the spell Blink, any Goblin Leecher can tell you that. :mad: It gets rid of one shadow but that isn't really "working"...

Probably it doesn't work on Utsusemi either - but if you want to be sure, go to Sauromugue and ask a Yagudo Herald.

However, while Dispel doesn't work on Utsusemi, Stonega and Diaga do... I'd recommend Stonega because you can still Sleep2 him afterwards, which gives you plenty of time to dump a full enfeeble and enhance set (not including the DoT enfeebles, but you can live without those) before you start busting out the Thunder3s and Drain if he ever lands a hit. :thumbsup: Go RDM!

[Apple Pie]

OK, here're clips of the last game, San d'Oria vs Bastok, no LV restriction.

Last week, we had shameful experience; losing to Bastok by 6 : 200. Some people watching the game even called us, "Muscular Brain Kingdom (脳ç_‹çŽ‹å›½) San d'Oria" because they just charged and got killed...

This time, I went there to revange them. Luckily, we had enough mages and our group was well-organized, too. We finally won by 80 : 40 something.

I kept recording the movie till the end of the game but the clip is larger than 10GB and I have no way to upload the whole thing even I compress it. Therefore, I made a digest. I removed BCNM50 clip...

1. The Beginning (http://www5.sppd.ne.jp/grendal/FF11/ballista_01.wmv)

It was fun to see two MNKs (Hume and Galka) did suprise attack on my friend (Elvaan PLD) with Invisible.

2. RDM isn't soft! (http://www5.sppd.ne.jp/grendal/FF11/ballista_02.wmv)

Asran Fists from LV75 Gal MNK wasn't hard enough to beat this tiny taru RDM down. However, LV75 MNK is very hard since their attack speed is very fast. You see I had my spell casting inturrupted.

3. DRK 75 Taru vs Sub-DRK 65 Taru (http://www5.sppd.ne.jp/grendal/FF11/ballista_03.wmv)

This Taru DRK is always brave but he was a little reckless this time. BTW, see his gorgeous gears? However, his Guillotine only did 222 dmg on me. I think he should change his weapons but he may take pride in his Scythe.

Well, it was good to use my "Hyahhoi Blade" hehe :P

4. Scored 6 petras. (http://www5.sppd.ne.jp/grendal/FF11/ballista_04.wmv)

Scoring 6 out of 80 isn't bad for LV65 mage, isn't it? It is hard form me to get Gate Breach status.

5. Killed first time. (http://www5.sppd.ne.jp/grendal/FF11/ballista_05.wmv)

Again that Gal MNK! I hate him! I know he is a good guy in XP PT though =) He again used Invisible and did surprise attack on me... I had no MP and couldn't do anything.

6. To the end of the game (http://www5.sppd.ne.jp/grendal/FF11/ballista_06.wmv)

We were winning and the game was almost over but I still had 120% TP left. So, I just wanted to have fun.

Well, the reason my hyahhoi blade only did 100 dmg was because he had Utsumi I on... (After the game, he told me he had it on.) He counter-striked me with his Rampage and I was killed. It was fun to see WS vs WS anyway.

Overall, it was an exciting game. The only problem of Ballista is it's too costly. I brought two dozens each of Seafood Kebob, Echo Drop, and Poison Portion - around 50K plus 7.5K entry fee. I hope S-E did something for other people to enjoy without spending their money.

I was bored and didn't feel like leveling this taru RDM but Ballista encourages me to go. I have a lot of things to do but I want to see RDM's potential. I wanna try RDM 75/RNG 37, /NIN 37, /WAR 37, and so on. So, hope you guys also have fun there.

[Kilgraw]

From my one experience in Ballista, DoT spells on you are a positive thing, not a negative.

[Patchinko]

The one of you eating and surviving the Asuran Fists is beautiful. ^^

[Humehero]

Agreed you taking Asuran Fists was great - I love it that you owned the pld ^^ good job Apple Pie.

[pdac]

Awesome videos ^^

Its great to see how people use tactics in the game, I'll file these away for my next matches.

[fyrewyre]

NM
Nin hands down. Unless there is a GA spell.

HNM
nin IMO because a nin/whm has acces to stat heals while rdm/nin doesnt and has a low evade,sword, sheild, parry, and other skills therefore they will loose a shadown once hit everytime the mob swings.

Ballista
If you pit a rdm against a nin in ballista you WILL get different/varried results and i say this because i watched a nin/war slaughter a blm, rng, war, and rdm with '/tell fyreus nah, little or no problem' (lmao funniest line in the whole 4mins he lived) rdm using anything physical is useless since nin's blind is just twice as powerfull (cant debate there) and getting nuked for 80X4 in 8-10 secs on a rdm HP bar isnt all so nice to deal with and the silence/stun/poison/def weakening/ katanas.. thats a different story as well as shuriken.

On the other hand you have the diaga aka utsusemi killer along with refresh and debuffs IF your not silenced. as for bind, dont use it cause resistance is way up there and if you want gravity then pray he doesnt sub thf.

anywho, im a lil biased since the job let me down so take it with a grain of salt.