Is it REALLY that bad a subjob?

[Ripersnifle]

Seems to me that the fact that you don't need MP would make this a better sub for jobs that don't have any MP in and of themselves that want to add a little support to their repetoir. Yeah, your songs won't be terribly powerful, but they will affect the whole group and it seems to me that it would be better than the occasional gimped heal. You don't have to worry about resting to recover MP, and you don't have to worry about singing all the time because hey, it's your sub. What do they expect?

Obviously those who like to have *the* sub for whatever job they pick won't dig the idea, but I think that for those more adventurous that it could probably work out pretty well.

Ideas, comments, suggestions, angry declarations of my idiocy?

I'd appreciate any and all.

[Sinzer]

I use Bard as a sub for my RDM and personally up till level 15 I found it very useful, for solo it was great as it meant I had to use less MP.

In groups it is nice to load up Paeon or Minuet, it does help a little bit.

Throughout these types of games I find that I am a MP conservationist, all the other mages seem to blow MP away around me and I rarely use above 30MP a fight.

This is even after I ask spell orders, which inevitably get ignored and I have people casting over my Dia or Paralyze. So I tend to save my MP for emergencies, which usually works out fairly well, plus I eat food and have MP+ items so I usually have the same amount of MP as a WHM sub.

BRD sub has an impression of being gimped, personally I think it is a great sub and is even just as good with a full bard in the group as it takes a little pressure of them. Plus who wouldn't like have madrigal, minuet and paoen stacked at all times.

[Cymmina]

Yes. Bard is not a job you should be subbing for party situations.

It takes about 12 seconds to sing a buff song. That's 12 seconds when you aren't nuking (blm), healing (whm), attacking (melee) or doing anything else expected of your main job. That is not helpful for effective parties.

If you really want the songs, bring a full time bard. That's their job.

Trying to justify bard as a sub is like trying to justify whm as a sub for a melee job. If you want to solo, by all means. In a party, you should be grabbing a different sub. Sure, you can heal yourself and take a little bit of pressure off of the main healer, but every heal you do is time spent not dealing damage that is expected of your main job, not to mention the fact that you're healing piddly amounts of hp.

[Leri]

The songs take awhile to cast. If you are a mage pick another mage job for subjob the MP count you are losing with /BRD hurts.

I've noticed also when I sing a song with WHM/BRD instead of BRD/WHM it also doesn't last as long. Meaning you would have waste another 12 seconds before a full bard does. Perhaps this is just me.. :confused: Truthfully I don't see where another job has that kind of time spare.

As a full bard I barely have time to get all my songs off before monsters die. More often then not my fixed party kills the monster as I am singing my last song.

In the party: WHM, RDM, RNG, THF, PLD and me the BRD.

I will sing:
Dex Etude (for the THF and PLD seems to hit often enough with it over Madrigal)
Requiem
Therody
March
Prelude on RNG
Requiem
Therody
Ballad

Usually by the time I get to Ballad the thing is either dead or I turn around to watch it die. (Unless its really hard) After playing WHM for such a long time I can't see where I'd have the time to run up and sing a song. Unless you do it before battle and if you do it most likely wear off before it could be useful. As RDM you should be more focused on enfeeble and then nuke a bit.. Our RDM has enough to do all by himself. :sweat: I've also fail to see where a BLM would have time. :sweat:

[Sinzer]

I make sure my puller has macros set up so that I know when they have pulled. I start singing before they arrive back at group, just as they arrive the buff will go off.

I then load with Dia, Paralyze and Blind. Then I cast slow if it is really tough, then I run into melee. After the fight I start singing Paeon and then rest.

The songs last the same amount of time as if you were singing with bard.

It is not an awesome SJ, but it functions well, plus I really did not want to have to level up WHM, RDM and BRD all in one go as Bard was my preferred main job.

The next job to level will be WHM as I think that WHM is a better sub for bard than the current RDM sub I have.

[subjectivist]

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=20867

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=28742

tadaa... people have discussed this tons already

[Lily]

lol subjectivist your avatar is almost a complete reversal of mine on another forum, except for the clothes. :)

http://www.aprx02.dsl.pipex.com/lilybard1.jpg

[subjectivist]

yeah, I had the pic already but I think you inspired me to make it into an avatar