[ShepardG]

Wow. Ezariel, you missed the point of this thread, and you probably miss the point about alot of things tha happen in your real life also. This is because your brain is stupid.

The OP, Fallenintoshadows, was asking the ffxionline community advice on whether or not she should stay in her LS or find another one. She explained why she had doubts, and was verifying the validity of her feelings, with other players of the video game, NOT DIRECTLY INVOVLED IN THE SITUATION.

(on a sidenote, FIntoS, if your a dude in real life, apologizees)

So far everyone has felt that, if they where in her situation, they would find a new shell. This is our advice, are we fucking demanding that she get's herself a new linkshell, no were not. Only saying what we would do in that situation.

You have clearly stated what you would do in that situation. Good on you, congrats. I'm glad you play by the made up videogame rules that someone has said you should play by if you want your video game item! Heaven forbid you get in a car accident, or your schedule changes at work, or your stupid brain accidently cuts your fingers off with an electric bread knife. I wonder if your "Commited player" status will still be intact if you can't type on the right side of the keyboard.

Your rules are stupid, just like your brain.

p.s.

Your brain probably isn't stupid, but when it comes to this situation, you should re-evaluate

[Ezariel]

Didn't miss the point at all, this is an old, tired, and overbeaten dead horse topic that has been seen more than a few times on many forums. I merely disagree with the ops expectations and stated a counterargument. You may agree or you may not, but both you and I have valid arguments that are relevant to our respective situations.

[Mog]

Attendance should be proportional to how much gear someone gets. Obviously, someone who puts more work farming and camping should receive more than someone who hasn't attended as much.

That said, people have lives. Even if you can't make every run due to RL, you should still be entitled to getting gear once in awhile. This "committed" status is retarded. And if you don't think it is, you really need to have a reality check.

[hexx]

Originally Posted by Ezariel

You think I missed the point? Well you missed mine. Point is, there are rules in real life and there are rules in linkshells. In both cases you either live by the rules and pay the consequences when you don't, or you move. And for all you people spouting on about giving it to good players instead of good attendance... You could have the entire membership of BluGartr in your ls and if they didn't show up when crunch time came to get an event done, they would be useless to you.



But you want those who do sacrifice their free time to give up the fruits of their labor to you with that attitude? Talk about being selfish and hypocritical...

Thats the thing you idiot, NOBODY is sacrificing anything in the shells I run. I run with different crews for Dynamis, Sky, Sea, Limbus, Nyzul, and such. Each one of these groups has separate attendance records for that very reason, to keep things fair for those who run with OTHER shells during OTHER hours. Yes, rules are needed, for without them, theirs chaos and anarchy. But its a completely different story when those rules are stupid and idiotic, made only for the benefit of the few, not the general populace.

You also seem to forget that there is a difference between, not "wanting" to go, and not being "able" to show up for said event. Its one thing to have full access to all current endgame areas, and on a Limbus day for example when you are needed on a specific job, you are LFP on another; and different when you just DONT have access to a specific area. Learn to tell the two situations apart otherwise, you fail at both this game, and RL.

Peace out.

[TheGrandMom]

A point based system is based on ATTENDANCE. So having another rule in place that says even if a player has enough points to bid for an item BUT not perrfect attendance they automatically lose the lot is asinine and redundant. It was obviously put in place because some people were butt hurt over losing their points because of the ls reorganization and they wanted a guarantee that they would get the drop they wanted or they would leave the shell. *insert qq'ing, stomping of feet here by the whiners*

It's like your local store handing out punch cards and they put a punch on it for each time you buy something from their store. So you don't go everyday but you are there when you can. You get your punch card filled and now you are waiting till they have an awesome item that you can get for free with your punches. The day its in you are at the store and you go up to the counter to claim it. The clerk looks at the line behind you and says to the guy thats at the back of the line "Hey Mr. X come on up and claim your prize!" and there you stand, first in line getting the shaft. Don't tell me that wouldn't piss you off, someone getting preferential treatment over you? That's what this ls is preparing to do just to appease the people with their panties in a bundle. It's just plain and utter BULLSHIT.

[Rothy]

Originally Posted by Ezariel

But you want those who do sacrifice their free time to give up the fruits of their labor to you with that attitude? Talk about being selfish and hypocritical...

Because being litterally unable to attend an event means you don't deserve anything if you still go to every event you possible can.

If people are so obsessed with having the best chance of getting drops.. why not just keep a 100% attendance so they have more points to outbid/buy it before anyone else can?

Edit: Apparently I can't read post times until I press that nice "Post Reply" button, dammit.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Not only is this point system screwed up, it prevents point-spending. You want people to spend those points, preferably as much as possible so they go to the back of the line and other people get a chance to bid on the item.

If only those with priority status can bid that lowers competition and lowers risk, so people wouldn't have to bid so much if those without "committed" status aren't allowed to bid. This keeps the "committed" players with the power to get items while the other members are simply used by the LS.

Its not a fair system and I haven't seen any LS that's lasted that currently uses this system.

[Rothy]

Originally Posted by Omgwtfbbqkitten

Its not a fair system and I haven't seen any LS that's lasted that currently uses this system.

Cause it sucks!

If that shit was pulled in any LS I joined, I'd be the first one out the door.

[Ezariel]

I think what the ls is trying to stop is a painfully common problem with shells that have been around for quite some time. You've got that guy in your ls... He's been in the shell for 3 years and gotten everything he ever wanted and has enough points to outbid anyone on anything... The only thing left that he wants is a Homam Body for his newly leveled DRG. He has had 100% attendance to this point, but suddenly he increasingly has to "work" on more and more nights that you schedule events. But somehow this amazingly demanding and random schedule doesn't prevent him from having 100% attendance on nights you schedule to kill Proto-Omega...

It's called apathy, and it plagues every ls at some point in time. And it leads to trouble in the end. What if that person is your main PLD that you have invested tons of gil and time in? What do you tell your members when events get cancelled because he doesn't show, or you lose a kirin pop set because you decided to take a pickup pld (or your backup) and fail? How do you think your members will feel when suddenly he does actually show up for the night that he wants and you give him the best prize available there? Resentment is the result.

So what do you do? I have seen more than a few endgame ls'es broken because of this exact issue after massive dissention built up in the ranks. Giving great items to someone who is mysteriously there for only the nights they want reeks very suspiciously of favoritism. Maybe the OP isn't that person and gives it everything he/she can, when they can. Maybe he/she isn't telling us the entire truth, they sound an awful lot like that person in question to me. Maybe I don't agree personally and would not put up with such rules. But I do applaud this ls for at least trying to find a way to address this issue.

[Neverslip]

Originally Posted by Ezariel

So what do you do?

Um... nut it up?

I totally understand trying to keep the investment viable (PLD people sank gil into) BUT... RL is RL, people change, priorities shift. Shafting potential additions with rules such as the one in question is NOT gonna engratiate these new players to the LS by making them essentially slaves for the 'leet.

I sure as sh!t wouldn't even apply to a LS that implemented that lop-sided rule. Newbs are people too... they deserve goodies just like the rest of us....

NEED before GREED

[Nataka]

I hate people that feel because of one thing or another that they are more entitled to something than everyone else. It's why I hate people who play 'required' classes just because they're required, like bard or black mage for end game etc. They're the people that will say "I'm not doing Y unless you have X, Z, B, A, and C in place for me!"

Like bards that wont join a party if it isnt PERFECT, or black mages that threaten to quit linkshells if they're not carried to all events on a golden chariot while being fed grapes and fanned.

People tend not to get this resentment of mine, and seem to think Bards SHOULD be treated with feigned respect so they wont leave the party, but it just makes me wanna scream that this should be allowed. A bard is no better than anyone else.

Similiarly, no one should be above the law, so to speak, in a LS point system just because. Just because you have a job, or school, or kids, or whatever, doesnt mean you are less devoted to your LS. Devotion means you go to every event YOU ARE ABLE to. Non-devotion, or whatever, would mean you're futzing around in whitegate instead of doing an event that's going on at the same time.

Honestly, leave the shell. My social shell is currently trying to make sure that the endgame shell we're almost all in doesnt go toward the favoritism route, but if it comes down to it we're gonna leave and find another one. It's probably best to get out now before other LSes get flooded with requests from former LS-mates for entry heh.

[Malacite]

Originally Posted by Nataka

Like bards that wont join a party if it isnt PERFECT, or black mages that threaten to quit linkshells if they're not carried to all events on a golden chariot while being fed grapes and fanned.

How sweet it is!

No seriously though I've only been in 2 shells that use points and both have their ups and downs.

[Losrase]

Originally Posted by Nataka

I hate people that feel because of one thing or another that they are more entitled to something than everyone else. It's why I hate people who play 'required' classes just because they're required, like bard or black mage for end game etc. They're the people that will say "I'm not doing Y unless you have X, Z, B, A, and C in place for me!"

Like bards that wont join a party if it isnt PERFECT, or black mages that threaten to quit linkshells if they're not carried to all events on a golden chariot while being fed grapes and fanned.

People tend not to get this resentment of mine, and seem to think Bards SHOULD be treated with feigned respect so they wont leave the party, but it just makes me wanna scream that this should be allowed. A bard is no better than anyone else.

Similiarly, no one should be above the law, so to speak, in a LS point system just because. Just because you have a job, or school, or kids, or whatever, doesnt mean you are less devoted to your LS. Devotion means you go to every event YOU ARE ABLE to. Non-devotion, or whatever, would mean you're futzing around in whitegate instead of doing an event that's going on at the same time.

Honestly, leave the shell. My social shell is currently trying to make sure that the endgame shell we're almost all in doesnt go toward the favoritism route, but if it comes down to it we're gonna leave and find another one. It's probably best to get out now before other LSes get flooded with requests from former LS-mates for entry heh.

We can do that!

/em start making a demand list...

[hexx]

Originally Posted by Ezariel

I think what the ls is trying to stop is a painfully common problem with shells that have been around for quite some time. You've got that guy in your ls... He's been in the shell for 3 years and gotten everything he ever wanted and has enough points to outbid anyone on anything... The only thing left that he wants is a Homam Body for his newly leveled DRG. He has had 100% attendance to this point, but suddenly he increasingly has to "work" on more and more nights that you schedule events. But somehow this amazingly demanding and random schedule doesn't prevent him from having 100% attendance on nights you schedule to kill Proto-Omega...

It's called apathy, and it plagues every ls at some point in time. And it leads to trouble in the end. What if that person is your main PLD that you have invested tons of gil and time in? What do you tell your members when events get cancelled because he doesn't show, or you lose a kirin pop set because you decided to take a pickup pld (or your backup) and fail? How do you think your members will feel when suddenly he does actually show up for the night that he wants and you give him the best prize available there? Resentment is the result.

So what do you do? I have seen more than a few endgame ls'es broken because of this exact issue after massive dissention built up in the ranks. Giving great items to someone who is mysteriously there for only the nights they want reeks very suspiciously of favoritism. Maybe the OP isn't that person and gives it everything he/she can, when they can. Maybe he/she isn't telling us the entire truth, they sound an awful lot like that person in question to me. Maybe I don't agree personally and would not put up with such rules. But I do applaud this ls for at least trying to find a way to address this issue.

More and more it seems like you dont get the point the OP was trying to express. Y ou keep bringing up that the rules are set to prevent your bolded example above, but you dont seem to realize that she shows up to the events she HAS ACCESS TO, and only misses out on the ones she DOESNT HAVE ACCESS TO. How can you "applaud" an LS that creates a "committed" status, i.e. "asskissers"? Did you not read what I posted earlier? How fair would it be to the members of my Dyna shell if I suddenly decided to ALSO do sea and sky, and that those members who run with ANOTHER group for said events were to be classified as "non-committed" and therefore fall behind in point for lotting relic? Drive that through your thick head that not everyone has the time or the access to do ALL the events that an all-encopassing shell does, but if they at least make time to show up to what they CAN, then why fuck them over like that?

As for the second bolded section: Its one thing to show up say, only on days when you do sky gods or sea jailers, and another when you can only show up on monday, wednesday, and friday because that is all your schedule allows. How is it your fault is those are the days the LS pops gods or jailers? Remember the real life is more important than this game, and from what you say, you make it seem like one should plan their life around the game, not the other way around.

All in all, shut up, or at least quit putting your foot in your mouth because instead of helping your cause, you're only shooting it in the foot even more.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

BRDs who think they have any great amount of power just because they are BRDs are complete fools and anyone that treats a BRD like they're that powerful are also fools.

Reasons are simple.

BRD is easy to level.
BRD is easily replaceable.
Most people seriously into endgame have a BRD levelled, they just hide it 99% of the time.
Leaders and sackholders will hide their BRD 100% of the time.
BRD can have shit for gear and still be invited, thus no one will care how awesome you think your BRD is.
BRD is a tool, not a person.
BRD does not have a name besides "BRD."