[Ziero]

Originally Posted by Malacite

Yes it is, and you're missing the point.

Whether SE is doing this in purpose or not I can't say, but I've been reading about this in a book "Predictably Irrational"

Basically, SE is taking familiar concepts but changing the name & appearance as much as they can to make it seem like a completely different, authentic experience. The book cites an example of how a guy makes the transition between Dunkin' Donuts and Starbucks

No, it's not. If you change the name, style and substance of something, you turn it into a completely different object. At this point in time Lancer is *not* (FFXI) Drg in any way shape or form. The only similarities they share at all are using spears as a main weapon, which is something you can find in numerous different types of games. If they allow us as much class customization as they claim they will, then FFXI *will* be a genuinely different experience from FFXI altogether. If I can take my Gladiator and go balls to the wall full DD while another guy takes his Gladiator and goes full plate turtle defense tank, it would accomplish something that could never be done in FFXI. Sure a Pld could DD on little pink birds and got a single shiney WS, but good DDs always blew their damage away. And sure a Sam could tank little pink birds and other small man events, but they were far from a real tank. FFXIV seems like it will let us take any class and mold it to each person's preference. Which is something that could not be done in FFXI.

[Balfree]

FFXIV. Everyone is a BLU.

[Pwnagraphic]

Originally Posted by Ziero

(FFXI) Drg in any way shape or form. The only similarities they share at all are using spears as a main weapon

lol what?

[Armando]

Aim (Sharpshot) and Barrage have made prior appearances in association with Ranger and Gunner. Not to mention Rosa was White Mage/Ranger hybrid.

Good call, didn't associate Aim with Sharpshot.

It is a waste actually,

No it's not. There are many kinds of polearms, there have been many types of warriors throughout history that have made use of them and there are many ways to use them. You could easily have two polearm jobs: the apparently lightly-armored Lancers, using their weapons with two hands, and a heavily armored knight with spear and shield. Why should Gladiator be the only heavily armored job? Why can't there be more than one spear type when people wouldn't bat an eyelash if a jobs with rapiers or katanas suddenly turned up? If they were so inclined they could even make an oriental job out of naginatas.

[Ziero]

Who said Gladiator was the only heavily Armored job? Both Marauder and Lancer have heavy armor on. Hell, they even said Lancers CAN use different types of Lances and Spears for different purposes, including slashing weapon spears, so it's possible you could have a Defensive Lancer build. If done right, they wouldn't need to add new "classes" because people can *make* their own. Which seems to be the whole point of classes instead of jobs, more freedom for players to decide their own roles within each class type. To the point where two people with the same class can accomplish two completely different roles in two completely different styles. In FFXI, if you were a Drg, you were a DD. In FFXIV, two lancers may server two completely different roles.

Originally Posted by Pwnagraphic

lol what?

.

FFXI Drgs: Wear medium armor, use spears and lances, balanced front line melee DDs, have jump based abilities, a strong relation to dragons and a pet wyvern.

FFXIV Lancers: Use spears and lances, can be used to fight at a distance and have little relation to dragons.

Is it really that hard to see how little they have in common?

[Armando]

Sorry but the Lancer's attire is NOT heavy armor. It's mostly leather save for gauntlets. Marauders seem to be armored, but not nearly as heavily as gladiators, which are shown encased head-to-toe in sheet metal. And the Lancer's description specifies two-handed polearms, and emphasizes their offense. There was no mention of one-handed spear wielding (save for javelins which are thrown one-handed, but you know that's not what I mean) or shields.

Yes, there will likely be customization but you can only stretch a job so thin. If they wanted a polearm user that specialized on defence, they could very well make another class. Whether they want to or not is another story, but it could be done.

[Malacite]

Originally Posted by Armando

Yes, there will likely be customization but you can only stretch a job so thin. If they wanted a polearm user that specialized on defence, they could very well make another class. Whether they want to or not is another story, but it could be done.

Keeping in mind they already stated you can use any equipment on any class provided you meet the stat requirements.


And technically in FF's history, DRG came 1st (FF2>3>4>5>>9>11>Tactics) it's just that the dragon-like armor & Jump didn't come along until 3 and the wyvern has only been in XI. But it's always been Dragoon, Tactics was the only game where it was called Lancer (note the dragon helmet) though I'd be interested to know if it goes by a different name for the JP, similar to how Warrior = Soldier and Paladin = Knight.

They've changed the aesthetics of the job, some of the mechanics and the name back to Lancer, but it's still at it's core DRG (if not at least based off it). "A rose by any other name" etc. etc.

[Tickmeoff]

Originally Posted by Malacite

though I'd be interested to know if it goes by a different name for the JP, similar to how Warrior = Soldier and Paladin = Knight.

竜騎士


Literally, "Dragon Mount Soldier," so the "Lancer" name was just a bad translation/didn't feel like translating and just went by the appearance of the job.

[Armando]

Keeping in mind they already stated you can use any equipment on any class provided you meet the stat requirements.

Shows how much I keep up with this stuff. Is it already in the sticky?

[Malacite]

I'm not sure, ask TGM >.>


But that's what the JP site describes lancer as? As usual, the NA version tries to fancy it up too much. If that's really what it says, then that just gives more credibility to myself & others who believe they will release more classic "DRG" abilities, and possibly even the wyvern, in future updates through guildleve.


I do love the idea of being a BLM in full-plate though

Just call me Ex-Death

[Pwnagraphic]

Originally Posted by Ziero

FFXI Drgs: Wear medium armor, use spears and lances, balanced front line melee DDs, have jump based abilities, a strong relation to dragons and a pet wyvern.

FFXIV Lancers: Use spears and lances, can be used to fight at a distance and have little relation to dragons.

Is it really that hard to see how little they have in common?

I can see them having little in common. But you said "No way shape or form." Then said "The only similarities." lol.. Now how can that be no way shape or form if they have 1 similarity?

Obviously the Lancer having a lance has created speculation. And that's all it is for now till we actually play the damn game. You could very well be dead wrong and vice versa for Mal.

[Takelli]

Originally Posted by Malacite

I do love the idea of being a BLM in full-plate though

While that would be nice. There would be huge penalties to the magic side mostlikley. Look at D&D type rules. IF you have anythign besides cloth armor on, on a mage, you take a spell penalty, making it harder to cast.

[Malacite]

idk about penalties, but they did say that doing something like that wouldn't be all that beneficial since the armor won't have magic-boosting stats.

But damned if it wouldn't look cool.

[Pwnagraphic]

Hell yeah.. I've always wanted to have a plate armored caster.