[Kailea]

Well as we know with the update we Dancers have "modes" now

(I have given the dances mode names off my opinion of use)

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Saber Dance "DD mode"
Cant Waltz but can Samba
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Fan Fance "Tank/Solo mode"
Cant Samba but can Waltz
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I have don't have Saber dance yet, and have only messed with fan dance a little in sky farming last night. I would like to see others thoughts and experiences with these two new dances, and see what we can apply them to.

Fan dance seems to help alot with soloing, taking far less damage at the start of a fight and allowing you to get the upper hand. This combined with /NIN and even a Joytoy (still don't have mine yet but want) and you will be a formidable soloer or even a tank if geared right.

[VZX]

Fan Dance is like diminishing potent phalanx. On Ullikumi , I took 50 damage of its heavy strike. It was very very low damage, but as I took more hits, the effectiveness decrease. IMO, this JA should not be used alone, but to be paired with utsusemi for tanking.

Saber Dance is very nice stuff for DDing, I've already seen couple times 17 TP return (as opposed 15) of my BF + Dancing Edge on Aura Statue. (can go up to 900 damage)

[Karinya]

Originally Posted by VZX

Fan Dance is like diminishing potent phalanx. On Ullikumi , I took 50 damage of its heavy strike. It was very very low damage, but as I took more hits, the effectiveness decrease. IMO, this JA should not be used alone, but to be paired with utsusemi for tanking.

Can you get enough hate that way, with just animated flourish?

For soloing I could see it, but for tanking you need to have more hate than the RNG, BLM or whoever...


P.S. It sounds to me like what you're describing is more like (new) Sentinel than like Phalanx. A phalanx strong enough to reduce a special attack to 50 damage would reduce all normal hits to 0.

[Kailea]

Originally Posted by Karinya

Can you get enough hate that way, with just animated flourish?

For soloing I could see it, but for tanking you need to have more hate than the RNG, BLM or whoever...


P.S. It sounds to me like what you're describing is more like (new) Sentinel than like Phalanx. A phalanx strong enough to reduce a special attack to 50 damage would reduce all normal hits to 0.

yeah it is more like sentinel,

also at first I did not see the need to merit more then one point in it (fully merited will bring it down to 2:30 recast) untill I noticed that around 2:30 into the effect its really bad -.- and it seems that it could be refreshed at that time, if you had it fully merited

[Ziero]

Originally Posted by Kailea

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Fan Fance "Tank/Solo mode"
Cant Samba but can Waltz
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lolFanFance

Originally Posted by Karinya

Can you get enough hate that way, with just animated flourish?

For soloing I could see it, but for tanking you need to have more hate than the RNG, BLM or whoever...

P.S. It sounds to me like what you're describing is more like (new) Sentinel than like Phalanx. A phalanx strong enough to reduce a special attack to 50 damage would reduce all normal hits to 0.

IIRC it increases enmity on all actions taken, which means your cures pull more hate. So you'd be like a Pld light or such. I was also under the impression that the Dmg reduction slowly wears off on it's own as opposed to Phalanx, where it's full strength the whole duration. Or even Sentinel where it gets weaker as it absorbs dmg. Meaning if you have it up and have Utsu over it, by the time your shadows wear it'll be less effective then it was at the start of the JA, even though you haven't been hit yet.

Originally Posted by Kailea

yeah it is more like sentinel,

also at first I did not see the need to merit more then one point in it (fully merited will bring it down to 2:30 recast) untill I noticed that around 2:30 into the effect its really bad -.- and it seems that it could be refreshed at that time, if you had it fully merited

Is it 2:30 or 3:00? First merit to unlock and next 4 to reduce the timer by 30 seconds each?

Also, am I the only one who see Saber Dance as not just a "DD" move, but as something that can give a Dnc a large amount of TP in a short amount of time so they can use it for cures after canceling the Dance?

Edit: Also, as a War, I am very jealous of these Merits. Would you guys be willing to trade? I'd gladly give up Aggressive Aim, Savagry, Tomahawk AND Warrior's Charge =(

[Malacite]

I was asking some of the members of my Dyna LS Dynacore the other day about them.

Fan Dance is pretty good but you still can't really tank with it, and Saber Dance is f'ing nuts.

For the first minute it's a 50% double attack rate, with the effect diminishing every minute.

[Aylmer]

I think this will move dancer into tankablility via fan dance giving curing,dmg resist, and enimty gain. Also saber dance will give dnc more DD capability with haste samba still avaiable and a significant double attack increase. Plus the trait Closed Position that helps with both DD and Tank by providing extra ACC and EVA when the mob is facing you.

[VZX]

Originally Posted by Karinya

Can you get enough hate that way, with just animated flourish?

For soloing I could see it, but for tanking you need to have more hate than the RNG, BLM or whoever...

You're right.
I don't think that ability won't bring us anywhere closer to where PLD/NIN or NIN/DRK are. It's just a nice soloing tool when you have utsu recast down. Once you took a couple hit, it went back to close to no damage reduction

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Has there been any word about whether or not Saber Dance Stacks with things like Brutal Earring, /WAR and Fighter's Roll? Or are the effects just more diminishing when stacked like that?

Seems like an ability like this would be best used with /NIN given for people main handing a knife and that it would diminish the effects of Joyeuse were it in the main hand.

But on the other hand No Foot Rise and /SAM also sound pretty damn good together.

[Karinya]

Does Closed Position require that you actually *have* hate, or only that you be on the same side of the mob as the person who does have hate? (Or that you be in front of it, which is not necessarily the same for mobs that don't turn to face the person they hate - are wyrms the only example, or just the only one I can think of right now?)

[Ellipses]

Originally Posted by Omgwtfbbqkitten

Has there been any word about whether or not Saber Dance Stacks with things like Brutal Earring, /WAR and Fighter's Roll? Or are the effects just more diminishing when stacked like that?

Someone on the wiki discussion page claims to have gotten triple attacks with Saber Dance + Brutal Earring. If that's true, Saber Dance's DA is calculated separately, so the other sources stack a little better than normal (Brutal + Saber Dance, at the start, would be 55% to DA once and 2.5% to DA twice).

[Kailea]

Originally Posted by Karinya

Does Closed Position require that you actually *have* hate, or only that you be on the same side of the mob as the person who does have hate? (Or that you be in front of it, which is not necessarily the same for mobs that don't turn to face the person they hate - are wyrms the only example, or just the only one I can think of right now?)

from what I have seen it works opposite of sneak attack, you don't have to have hate, just stand in front of it

[Armando]

from what I have seen it works opposite of sneak attack, you don't have to have hate, just stand in front of it

Why would it grant an Evasion bonus if it requires you not to have hate?

[Ziero]

AoEs and Counter. Even if you don't have hate, a Mob can counter your attack if you're in front of it.

[Kailea]

Originally Posted by Armando

Why would it grant an Evasion bonus if it requires you not to have hate?

for the times when you do have hate. Like I said, just from the messing around I have done, and its not alot. Just going off my own experience