[hitlermom]

Please please please DO NOT flood the market AND lower price too much . :mad:
Silver Ingot was 24k 1 stack , then some poeple sold it for 23k , then somebody sold it for 22k-23k , then somebody sold it for 20k in price history , it happend in 1 day .:mad:
I don't know what was going on , but 1 thing I'm sure , they are all English Speakers (from their name)
On my server , mining does not bring you profit nomore , always 6-7 ppl in mine whenever I came to mine :confused: .And there is always tons of darksteel Ore in Bastok and Sandy . Iron Ore was sold like ... crack ... , but now it takes atleast 2 days to sell Ore
, darksteel and Gold Ore take forever to sell ,not even mention about "All Ore for sale, half price than AH " :mad:
Good job , English Speakers

[Khalum]

The attitude in your message makes me want to start mining and helping them push prices down. That was rude, man. There are probably constructive was to say what you mean. You, instead, just attacked all english speakers. Well done, jerk.

[stabby]

Welcome to the basics of capitalist economy, where price is determined by supply-demand curves. There are many excellent books on the topic; people in the real world have been writing about it for years. I suggest that you look into the matter and revise your demands to better jive with reality.

[Taga]

I agree about crafting. 90% of NA crafters are idiots. They lower the price around 1k below crafting price just so it sells a few hours earlier... then the other consumers won't bid higher... they just wait for more stupid NA crafters to put there stuff up.

Guilds should require an Economics test before signing up.

[neighbortaru]

oh great, here comes the NA/EN hate... :dead:

/agree stabby

[Evil Knight]

even though i am NA i agree whole heartedly. I may still be kinda new to the game but im not dumb. worst of all i think all the profit in sheep leather is gona go in the trash soon on rag

[Geo]

I agree...
*points to the iron and steel economy in fairy*

[seamus]

I don't see why it's a bad thing? Prices are low? So take advantage of whatever use they are being purchased for... it all evens out if you look at it from different perspectives.

[christophe]

Originally posted by Taga
I agree about crafting. 90% of NA crafters are idiots. They lower the price around 1k below crafting price just so it sells a few hours earlier... then the other consumers won't bid higher... they just wait for more stupid NA crafters to put there stuff up.

Guilds should require an Economics test before signing up.

so true

[DrMrLordX]

Originally posted by stabby
Welcome to the basics of capitalist economy, where price is determined by supply-demand curves. There are many excellent books on the topic; people in the real world have been writing about it for years. I suggest that you look into the matter and revise your demands to better jive with reality.

This would be fine if everyone participating in the sale of crafted, farmed, harvested, mined, etc good was aware of this fact.

Most people who sell items for low prices do so while blissfully unaware of the consequences of thier actions. They do so to sell quickly, thinking themselves to be master merchants, when in fact they have guarenteed their own financial failure, and have doomed all other crafters of the same item to similar failure.

They are "half merchants". They know how to dump items at low prices to get rid of them, but they do not(or will not) raise prices when they get the chance. Free-market forces would take hold IF all people who sold items on AHs across Vana'diel would actually RAISE prices when supplies ran low.

On the other hand, those of us who are crafters should expect to lose money when making items that require very little skill. A lot of these items are made because we want to gain skill. There isn't necessarily any demand for this stuff. I just got finished getting my clothcrafting up to 55, and I can tell you that there is no demand for capes, yagudo fletchings, bird fletchings, insect fletchings, or fly lures. Or, more accurately, the demand is so low that the market was flooded with these items long ago due to people using them as a cheap skill-up path. I can't really fault crafters for doing this. But, instead of sitting around, trying to sell my leftover fletchings and lures and other garbage, I took the hit and sold them all to NPCs. I saved a lot of time this way, and I had the money to cover the loss, so it was the best choice overall. Were I a brand-new crafter, I probably would have been forced to sell all my junk at low prices just to get some money back with which I could continue crafting. I know I was forced to do this a few times with blacksmithing and woodworking. The next time you see someone dumping loads and loads of equipment at low prices, please remember that sometimes it's just somebody who has leftover crap from gaining skill.

Part of the reason why I wrote my blacksmithing guide was to help people avoid producing lots of durable items that will saturate a market very quickly.

[Kalgareth]

Originally posted by hitlermom
Please please please DO NOT flood the market AND lower price too much . :mad:
Silver Ingot was 24k 1 stack , then some poeple sold it for 23k , then somebody sold it for 22k-23k , then somebody sold it for 20k in price history , it happend in 1 day .:mad:
I don't know what was going on , but 1 thing I'm sure , they are all English Speakers (from their name)
On my server , mining does not bring you profit nomore , always 6-7 ppl in mine whenever I came to mine :confused: .And there is always tons of darksteel Ore in Bastok and Sandy . Iron Ore was sold like ... crack ... , but now it takes atleast 2 days to sell Ore
, darksteel and Gold Ore take forever to sell ,not even mention about "All Ore for sale, half price than AH " :mad:
Good job , English Speakers

Sure Resellers are bad. But don't even attempt to pin this on us "English Speakers". I have seen numerous high lvl Japanese crafters completely destroy the market for money making items. And these were not skill path items.

On Midgard I have seen the following markets become absolutely saturated and destroyed by impatient Japanese players.

Death Scythes
Mythril Scythes
Carapace Breastplates
Brigandines
Breastplates
Iron Scale Mail
Steel Scale Mail
Darksteel Sheets
Royal Swordsman's Blades +2
Mythril Cuisses
Mythril Gauntlets
Mythril Breastplates

I could go on and on. If there is anyone messing with the economy it is the high end Japanese crafters that have a choke hold on the money making items at the AH and can craft things at a loss preventing others from making a profit.

And how could you possibly be complaining about Silver Ingots?! If you don't like the price at 20k then wait a few days with yours at 24k. They WILL sell. The demand for them is huge.

You can blame the ore pricing on a complete explosion of interest in mining. Prices may go down a bit but the inventory will still be going out the door at the same rate. If people want to sell their stuff at half price let them. They are the ones screwing themselves over as you sell yours in the AH at full price. Or better yet buy their ore and resell it.

[stabby]

Originally posted by DrMrLordX

Most people who sell items for low prices do so while blissfully unaware of the consequences of thier actions. They do so to sell quickly, thinking themselves to be master merchants, when in fact they have guarenteed their own financial failure, and have doomed all other crafters of the same item to similar failure.

I'm afraid you've missed the point. Them selling at whatever price they damn well please is an uncontrollable factor. No amount of crying on internet message boards will make them stop. If pricing it low gets them the money they want, then bully for them. Compete, or get out of the market until it stabilizes itself when they realise that their business model isn't sustainable.

Either way, these "ZOMG HALPS ME, I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE ARE MAKING QUESTIONABLE BUSINESS CHOICES, MAKES TEHM STOP GUYS" posts really need to stop. They do absolutely nothing but display the ignorance of the people posting them.

[Zafron]

Originally posted by DrMrLordX


Most people who sell items for low prices do so while blissfully unaware of the consequences of thier actions. They do so to sell quickly, thinking themselves to be master merchants, when in fact they have guarenteed their own financial failure, and have doomed all other crafters of the same item to similar failure.

I must disagree with this. I think when considering the stability of the market you have to consider various types of players. and how they effect the market in their own way.

The fanatic:

A player who plays for 16 hours a day(and they do exist) is going to have a production flow of materials that they will only be able to sell off by undercutting. If they don't undercut they will not be able to sell off the massive quantities of materials that they are producing. Subsequently they make more money by mass production and selling cheap. This hurts the market for casual players, but it keeps revenue for the fanatical players at optimum levels. This person probably makes the biggest impact on markets like fishing, mining and harvesting. Be glad AH mechanics only allow for each character to sell 7 items at a time, or these players would truely rule the economy.

The high level crafter:

This is the bane of the cooking craft, and others. Why does such a highly consumable product like Apple Pies sell for a loss? Because lv90+ crafters can afford to absorb the cost since they are making a killing off of Apple Pies+1. Out of 12 synths, if 6 of them yeild AP+1s they can sell the 2 stacks for 30k, and they have made crazy profit even if they just discard the 2 stacks of normal APs, but instead they put the normal APs on the market for a loss. This discourages crafters from boosting their skill, keeping out the competition, since APs are a popular synth to level off of(wether or not this is their intention is irrelevant).

The person who crafts for level and not for profit.

I'm one of these. I take a loss on my synths because i am not willing to wait for my stuff to sell over the AH before i continue leveling my craft, I undercut in order to get them out of my inventory faster to make room for more synthed products. For me fast lving up > profit. My cash flow is enough where i can afford to take a sizable loss and never stop synthing.

The affect that these last two people have on the economy can be seen in the mithkabob market. Mithkabobs still sell for a profit(albeit small). Why? Because it is unaffected by both high level crafters and leveling crafters. People don't level off mithkabobs. Its an expensive synth so synth failures are very costly. Much better to level off Meat Balls and pet food Delta at those levels. Since it isn't a leveling item, levelers aren't undercutting. Also at 36 a 90+ cook will have a solid success rate on chiefkabobs resulting in not as many mithkabobs to put on the market(In contrast apple pies are level 47 which means more AP+1 failures). Thus the only people selling mithkabobs are selling specifically for profit and will be unwilling to sell for a loss. This results in pure supply and demand curves and an equilibrium cost that is above material cost.

I don't doubt that there are people who just don't have any game economy savy, but to place the poor market conditions solely on these people is incorrect. And to stereotype English Speakers as being the cause of the economy's problems is just plain ignorant.

[snoop1050]

they are all English Speakers (from their name)

how do you know someone is english from there name?
i've been in japanse party's and would not have known they we're japanese just from looking at there name.

[Khaelyn]

Originally posted by hitlermom
Please please please DO NOT flood the market AND lower price too much . :mad:
Silver Ingot was 24k 1 stack , then some poeple sold it for 23k , then somebody sold it for 22k-23k , then somebody sold it for 20k in price history , it happend in 1 day .:mad:
I don't know what was going on , but 1 thing I'm sure , they are all English Speakers (from their name)
On my server , mining does not bring you profit nomore , always 6-7 ppl in mine whenever I came to mine :confused: .And there is always tons of darksteel Ore in Bastok and Sandy . Iron Ore was sold like ... crack ... , but now it takes atleast 2 days to sell Ore
, darksteel and Gold Ore take forever to sell ,not even mention about "All Ore for sale, half price than AH " :mad:
Good job , English Speakers

1. Nice name ... way to generate sympathy. At least you live up to it...
2. So ... how much is too much, according to you? You left out the acceptable prices in your 'complaint.'
3. Actually, I'm pretty sure of 'one thing'... that you posted here just to be annoying and have no intention of ever coming back to see where this thread had gone. Which is too bad, because if you had made a genuine complaint ('the new players are damaging the economy') and offered some actual suggestions ('we should let the new players know what the kind of prices they can get for ore and ingots') instead of being insulting, accusatory and outright rude, this thread might have been a useful resource.