[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Originally Posted by Kylen

No, buff values for most rolls are not constant; if the COR is lower level than the target, they scale according to the level difference ratio. Essentially, the formula is (COR's level) / (Target's level) * normal buff strength. This has been proven to be the case with Chaos Roll, Hunter's roll, and Wizard's Roll, and is the reason why the potency of those rolls is halved when using COR as a subjob (since it's basically a 37 COR rolling on a 75 melee). Evoker's Roll is an exception to this; it gives the same mp/tick no matter the level difference.

I think you misinterpeted my wording. The values I, II, III, etc. have fixed buff values, be they percentage-based or not. They are values that only get altered if a corresponding job is present in PT. The outcome of a given roll is seldom consistant given the randomized nature of Phantom Roll. How Chaos Roll affects players differs by thier base attack which is affected not only by equipment and buffs, but thier level as well, which also determines things like STR which affect your base Attack. The base attack is checked befor the percentage is applied, which is rather different from the capped bonus a BRD would add.

Now, if there is data that proves COR's level is a factor in this, I'd like to see it. This is kind of a situational subtopic to start with, but could be useful information anyway.

[Callisto]

I'll try to dig up the info, but I too recall seeing testing done with a 75 BLM, a lower level COR, and a BLM the same level of the COR, and it showed that the higher BLM got a nerfed effect on Wizard's compared to the lower one, I'll see if I can find where I saw it. Not that this is something that would be difficult to test anyways if you have a 70~ or lower COR and melee friends at both 75 and your level using Chaos.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Man, there's actually just so many gaps in the data we have for this job, even after nearly two years. And still so few CORs to test it with since no one has the balls to spend the gil on it. And when they do level it, they level it like BRD/WHM -1.

I'd really like to find out some pet roll data, my assumption is that Beast and Puppet roll are actually equal to Chaos and Hunter's Roll, as is Drachen Roll comprable to Warlock and Wizard's Roll.

I'm cranking out my DNC sub this week to see how that pans out for various situations, but I'd think it would play like a dream on a joyeuse or MK COR.

[Callisto]

Our LS' main COR has taken to /DNC very much, since he's usually there in more of a support capacity than anything else, and he thoroughly enjoys it.

I personally still can't bring myself to use anything but /RNG, I enjoy the playstyle and damage output too much, if I was going to /NIN for safety and gimp my damage I'd generally just go as BRD. Once I finish my MM merits I do plan on playing with /WAR to put up some epeen #'s and whatnot, but I'm still completely in love with COR/RNG.

Also, going back to the first question I asked a while back, it is looking alot like MAcc+ does in fact affect QD. I did some playing around with swapping out my Garrulous Ring for my Balhran's, and recently came into Denali Kecks which have less AGI than the War Brais+1 I was using but a few points of MAcc+, and my QD resists seem to have gone down significantly, though I haven't exactly put it to proper testing.

Can't wait, getting my Ugly Pendant very soon and Denali body as soon as it drops, then my QD set will be pretty much complete.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Originally Posted by Callisto

I personally still can't bring myself to use anything but /RNG, I enjoy the playstyle and damage output too much, if I was going to /NIN for safety and gimp my damage I'd generally just go as BRD. Once I finish my MM merits I do plan on playing with /WAR to put up some epeen #'s and whatnot, but I'm still completely in love with COR/RNG.

I think a lot of the problem with COR boils down to this:

People look a COR, think "RNG" and sub /NIN because that's what RNG subs. RNG subs /NIN only really to max out accuracy if they feel thats what is needed. RNG has Four Accuracy Bonus traits going for it, so /NIN isn't always needed by them. As a RNG, I more often sub SAM or WAR than I do /NIN these days

The other camp sees COR and thinks "BRD" and subs WHM because you can do /WHM viably to 30 and then they just keep going past 40 since a PT will accept you for Evoker's Roll and Dark Shot over any other factor. Then they look at all the BRDs subbing NIN and just assume they can do the same, I'll tell you right now that subbing NIN only hurts a COR's DoT and you shouldn't be caught with the sub unless you're pulling.

Both sides look at levelling RNG sub and see it as a financial hindrence or a levelling hindrence. Strange to me that no one sees NIN sub as the same hindrence. The cost of the Utsusemi Ichi and Ni scrolls alone far exceeds the the spending you would do to level RNG as a sub. RNG's one of the cheapest subjobs I've levelled. The armor angle of the jobs is extremely low maitenence compared to other melee classes.

I still favor /RNG above all else, I just see /DNC as a vastly more logical sub than /WHM at 60+ if I had to choose between those two. If you're scared to use a gun because of expense, then sub /DNC and gear for melee accuracy. Additionally, when you can afford to shoot for WS, DNC will give you one Accuracy Bonus trait. Not to mention COR can boost thier own TP gain with SAM Roll if absolutely needed.

[Nataka]

Sorry to interrupt the flow of the topic, but I have a question!

Can you give a list of 'good' corsair gear at level 75? By Good I don't mean like, salvage gear good or near the caliber of Relic weapons, but just what a good, average-joe corsair should have. Thanks a bunch. (this mainly deals with actual armor, I understand weapons).

[Callisto]

These are going to be opinions mostly, so some of what we say may wildly vary(I usually go for more hard-hitting stuff, BBQ generally uses more RAcc, for example)...

But anyways, here's the kinda mandatory pieces that shouldn't be extraordinarly difficult to get:

AF Body, Hat, and Feet
Optical Hat
Paluwhan Khazagand
Moldavite Earring
Crimson Finger Gauntlets
Amemet Mantle(+1)
Behemoth/Coral Rings(for Ranged Attacks)

As far as the slightly harder to get stuff, Denali Legs and Body are huge pieces, and aren't super difficult to get with a decent static(nowhere near the difficulty of Skadi pieces). Paluwhan Seraweels are also a very quality WS/TP piece that can be attained without much difficulty.

Here's my personal sets to give an idea how I gear:

TP, focuses on melee/ranged accuracy until I finish Sword/MM merits, then I'll consider a Haste build.

TP Set

Joyeuse
Martial/Steel(Coffinmaker for fights I will be doing almost entirely QD in)
Optical Hat
Peacock Charm(Spectacles work well too)
Hollow Earring
Fenrir's Earring
Paluwhan Khazaghand
War Gloves
Garrulous Ring
Woodsman Ring
Amemet Mantle+1
Potent Belt(Life Belt works just as well)
Denali Kecks(Paluwhan Seraweels work well too)
Crimson Greaves(Denali Feet are good for TP sets as well)

Ranged TP/Barrage, obvious focus on RAcc/RAtk

Ranged

AF Hat
PCC
Hollow Earring
Fenrir's Earring
AF Body
Crimson Finger Gauntlets
Behemoth Ring x2
Amemet Mantle+1
Gun Belt(if /RNG, Potent Belt otherwise)
Denali Kecks
AF Feet

WS Set, focuses largely on STR as it COR has alot of room to improve in that department.

WS Set

AF Hat
Light Gorget(QQ Collar is a good option if you don't have Sea yet)
Drone Earring(Triumph Earrings are good too, if you have the gil)
Fenrir's Earring
Blue Cotehardie(Aketon is good as well, AF Body is passable)
Crimson Finger Gauntlets
Garrulous Ring
Behemoth Ring(Slug) or Ruby Ring(Detonator)
Amemet+1
Warwolf Belt(big chunk of STR even though the rest doesn't do much)
Denali Kecks(would use Paluwhan Legs if I had them, War Brais+1 are good too)
AF Feet

And lastly, my QD set, obviously focuses on AGI, MAcc, and MAB. Not having Kecks/Pendant is no biggy, not having Moldavite isn't passable.

QD Set

AF Hat
Uggalepih Pendant
Drone Earring
Moldavite Earring
Blue Cotehardie(Same deal, Aketon is good too, Denali body is ideal)
Mage's Cuffs(Sand Gloves are good too, but a bitch to get)
Garrulous Ring(Any AGI ring is fine, really)
Balrahn's Ring(just as good as Emerald if you have it)
Amemet+1(Ideally have an AGI+ backpiece, but no more macro room, lol)
R.K. Knight's Belt(I'm poor and don't get many QD resists as is, Scouter's Rope is ideal)
Denali Kecks(this is the ideal peice, War Brais+1 are good too)
Crimson Greaves(Leaping/Bounding Boots are fine as well)

Like I said some of our other CORs equip differently and may give different advice, this is just what works for me.

Also, never, ever wear your AF pants. Keep them in case they add some useful AF+1 in the future, but don't let me catch you using them!

[Kylen]

Can you give a list of 'good' corsair gear at level 75? By Good I don't mean like, salvage gear good or near the caliber of Relic weapons, but just what a good, average-joe corsair should have. Thanks a bunch. (this mainly deals with actual armor, I understand weapons).

Weapon: Joyeuse or M.Kris
Ranged: Martial Gun or Coffinmaker, Peacemaker if you plan to pull
Ammo: Steel
Head: Walahra Turban/O-hat for melee, AF hat for Quick Draw
Neck: PCC if you can afford it, Spectacles are fine too. Sea gorget for weaponskills if you have one.
Earrings: Suppanomimi if you use sword. Brutal and Fenrir Earrings are good, too, as are Hollow and Diabolos' Earring for melee accuracy. Drone is decent for r.acc and Quick Draw.
Body: Pahluwan is the easiest to get "standard" endgame COR body piece.
Hands: War or Dusk Gloves for melee, Pahluwan/Barbarossa's/CFG for ranged.
Rings: 2*Woodsman/Snipers for melee, 2*Behemoth for r.acc, 2*Flame/Ruby for Slug, 2*Emerald/Breeze for Quick Draw, and Luzaf's Ring (yeah, that's a lot of rings but they're all fairly important)
Back: Amemet Mantle +1
Waist: Life Belt/Swift Belt for melee, Precise Belt/Gun Belt for ranged, Warwolf for Slug Shot
Legs: Pahluwan are easy to get and work fine for melee, ranged, and Slug.
Feet: I'd go Pahluwan here too if you're looking for something easy to get; War Boots and AF Boots work well, too.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

OK, that's simple enough:

• Head - Optical Hat or Walrah Turban for Joyeuse melee, if unattainable, use War Beret +1/Corsair's Tricorne for Quick Draw and Weaponskills.
• Body - Pahluwhan for melee, Blue Cotehardie for /mage duties
• Hands - If unable to get Barbossa Mouffles or Crimson Finger Gauntlets (abjuration), use Deadeye Gloves or, if you have a joyeuse, Dusk Gloves or Pahluwhan hands.
• Legs - Pahluwhan Legs or Dusk Trousers for melee, War Brais for Quick Draws, RSEusually offers a /mage options here unless you're Taru or you can use Prince's Slops. Crimson Cuissies (abjuration) is another option.
• Feet - War Boots, Corsair's Bottes, Dusk Lendelisians for melee stuff, Crimson Greaves (abjuration) for QD and /mage stuff
• Earrings - Drone Earringsx2 for Light/Dark Shot, Drone/Moldavite earring for other QDs, Fenrir's Earring (quested from Fenrir battle), Suppanomimi (from Divine Might) or Triumph Earring +1s
• Rings - If you don't have CoPs or ToAs done, Just use Behemoth Rings, they'll do you fine. If you have those missions done, though Rajas Ring and Jalzhan's Ring are very nice.
• Neck - Peacock Charm, Qiqirn Collar are nicest pre-sea gorgets, Wivre Gorget is acceptable, too.
• Waist - for /RNG Gun Belt, for other melee subs I'd go with Swift Belt (obtained from Sacrarium 50 cap NMs). RSE belts in the 60s sometimes give MP which are a a nice option for /Mage, there's an AGI/Evasion on Scouter's rope
• Main Hand - I highly reccomend Joyeuse (drops of Charybdis) for any COR with /RNG. /WAR or /DNC subjob, it really makes those subjobs shine.
• Guns - Coffinmaker (KS30 Drop) for times you're using Slugs, Martial Gun for when you use Detonator, Peacemaker for pulling and crowd control duties or /mage build.

Some of this stuff is questable, some requires mission commitments or sky access and BC/KSNM or NM camping, but by and large, most of this is what's going to be considered average or relatively simple to get with some dedication.

Also, never, ever wear your AF pants. Keep them in case they add some useful AF+1 in the future, but don't let me catch you using them!

Actually, I've thought of a use for them - /DNC Waltzes, but then, Crow/Raven legs give more - enmity, but with the Peacemaker, you'd be getting -5 enmity total with AF legs.

Ultimately, the answer to the question is partially going to be - "how much shit do you want to carry around?" I tend to keep waist, back, body and ring slots static. Even then, I'm only left with a handful of inventory slots. I tend to cut a couple corners on AGI since I'm mithra and I've really never had a problem landing QDs. I've heard Humes, Elvaan and Galka bitch up a storm about QD resists, but I've never seen a mithra or taru have problems there, so I generally only keep +17-24 AGI on me. If I need more, I have Squid Sushi on me anyway.

Finally, use anything but Steel Bullets for DD at 75 and I will beat you like the jackass you are.

[Callisto]

Originally Posted by Omgwtfbbqkitten

Actually, I've thought of a use for them - /DNC Waltzes, but then, Crow/Raven legs give more - enmity, but with the Peacemaker, you'd be getting -5 enmity total with AF legs.

Yeah I suppose at times the -emnity would be useful for curing if you didn't want to get Crow/Raven, although I have yet to find a situation outside of meripo where me getting hate has been any sort of a factor, even on things such as a low-manned JoTemp where I was one of only 2 DDs and was cranking out 400+ QDs every 60 seconds in addition to Ranged Attacks and WS'...I also only have 17 DNC at the moment though, so I'm not sure of the amount of hate Waltzes can pull, I'd highly doubt it'd be more than proportional Cure spells though.

I also typically wear Crimson Cuisses as /mage for the MP, but I know that isn't something to lump in the easy-to-get column(although I do consider Crimson hands/feet to be in that category, a couple of weeks in a Sky LS can usually get you a pair)

I guess I'm biased, the trend on Ramuh is rocking full-time AF legs as Bardair, it really drives me nuts.

Originally Posted by Omgwtfbbqkitten

I've heard Humes, Elvaan and Galka bitch up a storm about QD resists, but I've never seen a mithra or taru have problems there, so I generally only keep +14-24 AGI on me. If I need more, I have Squid Sushi on me anyway.

On XP-ish mobs I've found +26~ with +7 MAcc to be workable as an Elv and get next to no resists(usually as /WAR too, so pretty low base AGI, 62~ or something I think), for harder mobs between tossing on my Auster's to get +31~ and the MAcc bonus on it sets me for any endgame fights that I've done thus far as COR, which is really only Kirin, JoTemp, and a few other Sky Guardians.