[Darkhound]

Well, I got bard to 75 some time ago. And I was wondering, what is better... to pile up CHR or wind skill

What would be better for songs like finale, elegy and lullaby to land?

Thanks in advance

[Malacite]

O.o you don't know this and you're 75?

Skill takes precedence over CHR. Both help, but Wind Skill will do a lot more for landing those debuffs than CHR will. Keep in mind that while you have a tonne of CHR by 75 (unless you're a Galka or Mithra, that 12 point defeceit can hurt) BRD only has a C rating in singing abilities, as opposed to most jobs who's specialties are A- or A+. That's on average a 50+ skill difference you need to make up for, and no amount of CHR (that you can reasonably pile on anyway) will cover that.

In short, go for skill, then CHR.

[Yellow Mage]

Originally Posted by Malacite

O.o you don't know this and you're 75?

It's Bard.

[IfritnoItazura]

On Wind Instrument skill:

Originally Posted by Malacite

Skill takes precedence over CHR. Both help, but Wind Skill will do a lot more for landing those debuffs than CHR will.Keep in mind that while you have a tonne of CHR by 75 (unless you're a Galka or Mithra, that 12 point defeceit can hurt)

I'm not sure if things are that clear:

Originally Posted by IfritnoItazura

From: Kanican - Scholar Guide (Part IV)

It's a very meager clue. I still haven't came across the JP source material, but haven't been searching all that hard.

In that same blog entry, Kaeko touches upon how once having sufficient INT, additional INT has the same effect on resists as Magic Accuracy +1 for Elemental Magic. If the same goes for CHR, then each additional CHR could be equivalent to Magic Accuracy +1 for Bards and songs.

For the moment, I'll go with (Singing Skill or Charisma) > Wind Skill for offensive songs. (Buffs are different, of course.)

[Sabaron]

They are rather amorphous at present. Basically, your goal should be to "cap out" on CHR and boost Wind as high as possible. There is an equation whereby:

n * CHR = m * Wind

and for low values of CHR:

2 * CHR = 1 * Wind

Once you hit CHR cap (which depends on the stats of the mob you are fighting, dCHR and all that) , n changes, and once you hit a certain level of Wind skill, m does too. Now whether or not this changes to:

4 * CHR = 0.9 * Wind

which (from memory I didn't look it up, but then, this is the same as another thread in the Bard forum so do your own research before complaining) should be similar to the way regular accuracy works.

You forgot about an attribute which, at higher levels, exceeds both CHR and Wind Skill in terms of stick value:

Magic Accuracy

{Edit} I went and looked it up for you; please read this thread:

Beginning BRD endgame gear?

[Darkhound]

See my point guys..

Everyone says something different.
Some pople say that i would max chr others that i should max wind skill

it is so damn confusing...

I have done some reading and I still am unsure what is best for meriting, what is best for sky gods etc.. anyhelp?

[Sabaron]

Ok.... The point of all of the information given leads to the conclusion that:

To a certain extent 1 Wind Skill = 2 CHR until you hit the dCHR soft cap which is an unknown number.

dCHR = (Your CHR) - (Target CHR)

Most people assume that this soft cap occurs somewhere in the space between 100-120 for most mobs. After you hit the soft cap, the ratio expands so that:

1 Wind Skill = n CHR

where n is a number greater than 2 (possibly 4).


1 Wind Skill = 1 Magic Accuracy

up to the soft cap which may or may not be similar to melee accuracy:

Originally Posted by http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Accuracy

* When combat skill is ≤200, your entire combat skill value is used when calculating your melee accuracy.
* When combat skill is >200, combat skill exceeding 200 is reduced by 10% with respect to your accuracy, while combat skill of 200 or less is not reduced.

a) Take your combat skill and subtract 200.
b) Multiply the result number by 0.9.
c) Add the result from b) to 200 to get your accuracy contribution from combat skill.
d) Round all fractions down.

So, after a certain point, 1 Wind Skill = 0.9 Magic Accuracy.

The goal is to maximize MAcc in an equation that looks like this:

MAcc = MAccBonus + UnderCapWindSkill + OverCapWindSkill * 0.9 + UnderCapCHR + OverCapCHR * 0.5

Therefore, if you see the following two pieces of gear and you have 225 Wind Skill and 80 CHR, which do you pick?

Kirin's Osode
Minstrel's Coat

Osode v. Minstrel's Coat (below soft cap)

Osode = 10 MAcc
Minstrel's = 3 MAcc

Osode v. Minstrel's Coat (above cap?)

Osode = 5 MAcc
Minstrel's = 3 MAcc

Or let's look at the Ring Slot:

Nereid Ring
Balrahn's Ring
Light Ring

Rings (below cap)

Nereid: +3 Wind * 0.9 = 2.7 MAcc
Balrahn's Ring: +4 MAcc (+8MAcc in Assault)
Light Ring: +5 CHR * 0.5 = +5 MAcc

Rings (above cap?)

Nereid: +3 Wind * 0.9 = 2.7 MAcc
Balrahn's Ring: +4 MAcc (+8MAcc in Assault)
Light Ring: +5 CHR * 0.5 = +2.5 MAcc

Does that help?

[Darkhound]

Holy cow... thanks!

this is a bit complet.. so i need some time with those equations

How do you know all these calculations?

also what is dCHR stand for?

[Sabaron]

I know the equations from reading the source material on wiki combined with the information posted by II above and in other threads you can find in the Bard section of this forum (one of which I've linked above).

dCHR is as stated above, the difference between your CHR and the target's CHR.

The soft cap is believed to be dCHR = +10 or 10 CHR above the CHR of your target.

Here's a quote (from me) from another thread that also helps:

A 90th level D/D/D monster would have 85 Charisma (D/D/D is an assumption. Therefore, in order to fill out your 1:1 ratio CHR, you need +15 CHR. Anything above +15 will be halved versus high-level NMs. A D/D/D mob like a Heraldic Imp would have roughly 76 Charisma for which you would need only +11 to cap it out. This is provided the calculator is correct on its estimation of mob attributes. Noting that the calculator for PC attributes (which has a viewable in game display to check against) is off, apparently by a lot.

[Nuriko]

I would think this all might change if you're working on BST or DNC ... if I'm not mistaken, those jobs would also make use of that CHR.

[Sabaron]

Originally Posted by Nuriko

I would think this all might change if you're working on BST or DNC ... if I'm not mistaken, those jobs would also make use of that CHR.

Quite true, BST, DNC, and BRD mobs might have better CHR scores than others. D/D/D was an assumption loosely based on Sky gods which have high levels, but AFAIK none of them are "CHR" classed. You may find addtional CHR valuable against mobs like Xolotl or Pallas who have CHR-focused jobs.

[Zoltar]

I'm using a wind torque, nereid rings and leave the rest to CHR ie: Jester's Cape +1, Gleeman's Belt, etc

[Darkhound]

Do i want a set for madrian, minuet etc.. and another set for elegy, etc?

[Sabaron]

Beginning BRD endgame gear?