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Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

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  • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

    Are people still complaining about the UI in FFXI? It was so easy to navigate using the NumPad, I don't see how anybody could possibly have a problem with it. It was rigid and didn't allow for modification, but that's just how it was. The controls were perfect and I couldn't have asked for any better. So it didn't automatically use WASD, who cares? Use a brain cell and adapt.

    FFXIV's UI, on the other hand, feels like a step backwards. There are simply too many menus, and the macro menu is hidden away in the options for some reason. It's a pain in the ass to set up equipment swap macros, which are essential now that we can change jobs on the fly, because I have to exit out to check item names and then bring it back up all over again to write it out. It would be nice if they were somehow connected.

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    • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

      Are people still complaining about the UI in FFXI? It was so easy to navigate using the NumPad, I don't see how anybody could possibly have a problem with it. It was rigid and didn't allow for modification, but that's just how it was. The controls were perfect and I couldn't have asked for any better. So it didn't automatically use WASD, who cares? Use a brain cell and adapt.
      Control scheme isn't the same as UI, but for whatever it's worth I consider FFXI's UI bad simply because it's clunky as fuck. You can fix control schemes but you can't fix a laggy AI.
      It's a pain in the ass to set up equipment swap macros, which are essential now that we can change jobs on the fly, because I have to exit out to check item names and then bring it back up all over again to write it out. It would be nice if they were somehow connected.
      Isn't this bit the same in FFXI?

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      • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

        Originally posted by cidbahamut View Post
        Seriously, numberpad? Who the fuck uses that shit? They did the same damn thing with the PC version of FFVII, it was fucking terrible.
        It's been an option in pretty much everything since keyboards with extended numberpads became the default keyboard you would get with a computer.

        So you know, only like 20 years now.

        Using the number pad default on FFXI had the nice effect that when you wanted to chat, you just started typing. You also didn't have to move a hand off the movement controls to use a macro.

        wasd is a hold over from this shit:


        It's not any more usable then the number pad, it's blind nostalgia that keeps it going.
        I use a Mac because I'm just better than you are.

        HTTP Error 418 - I'm A Teapot - The resulting entity body MAY be short and stout.

        loose

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        • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

          Originally posted by Aksannyi View Post
          Yeah, FFXI was my first, too. I didn't know any better until I explored other games. Then I realized how clunky it really was. It was still easy for me because I was used to it, but anyone who comes from another MMO is usually gonna be like, "Wtf is this."
          ^ This. So this. (Except it's the other way around for me and I didn't like FFXI from the start with regards to control and UI)

          Mr. Yoshida already pointed this out and alluded to that fact. He came from EQ background and also played FPS games as well as other types of non-RPG MMO games. He saw the industry trend for the PC gaming market in how players were used to certain control layouts and that key to a game success was the ability to allow for full and unrestricted remap of keys and controls (key bindings) and as well as a solid UI. They've got someone that is going to work on redesigning the UI layout for FFXIV (Yes, even when it has already been released but WoW's UI is nothing like it was when it first came out and the same could be said of any other games, like Rift and Guild Wars 2) and another person will be in charge of a possible revamp of the game engine.

          SE"s being really serious and I love Mr. Yoshida's frank discussions and interviews where he not only lays out the problems but knows exactly what is causing the problems ... much to the chagrin of the "fanbois".

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          • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

            Originally posted by Mhurron View Post
            It's not any more usable then the number pad, it's blind nostalgia that keeps it going.
            I actually prefer WASD controls over everything else because you can still use the mouse while using WASD controls. They should include both WASD, and numpad controls.

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            • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

              In MMOs where you're using the mouse for some things, for example, WoW, which allows mouse control for targeting, clicking your selections in menus/on your action bar (even though you should be using keybinds for that shit), and camera movement, using the numpad isn't exactly practical. Using WASD makes more sense simply because you can use both hands simultaneously. Why the fuck would I want to use the numpad and then move my hand off of it to click something? When I could use WASD and click a millisecond later?

              Granted, FFXI is not as fast-paced as WoW is, so it would matter less, but that would get annoying after a while. (And since I started WoW using the arrows for movement and not WASD, I realized how much it was slowing me down once I switched hands for movement.)

              Not only that, it's a comfortable position for your hand to be. You scoot your hand over just a bit and you're easily able to type just like usual. Now I loved playing FFXI with a gamepad but thank god for autorun because I'd never be able to put down my gamepad to type unless I was standing still otherwise. Yeah, I still had to move my hand off the mouse in order to type in WoW but it was slightly less annoying. And I could manage simple "yes" or "naw" answers with my left hand, too, if I really needed my mouse at that moment.

              Anyway, long tangent aside, WASD movement isn't really that much of a dinosaur, it's really just comfortable to use. That's why it works. MMOs aren't using the numpad setup that FFXI was because it's probably not as comfortable to do your shit with that. And I would have honestly preferred to use my numpad for typing, uh, numbers. Kudos to FFXI for trying it, but it didn't seem to work for a lot of people, and most MMOs nowadays are still going the WASD route. There's something to be said for that.
              sigpic
              ~Aksannyi~~Hades~~75WHM~75RDM~75BLM~75SMN~73WAR~67SCH~47BRD~
              ~Mama Gamer~~Quitted July 2009/Bannt October 2009~~Excellence LS~
              ~I has a blog~~http://aksannyi.livejournal.com/~
              ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~




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              • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

                Originally posted by Aksannyi View Post
                There's something to be said for that.
                Yea, it's called tradition. It's the same reason why female circumcision is still practiced in certain cultures.

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                • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

                  It's called comfort. Why would they change something that so obviously works? Tradition doesn't have anything to do with it. If they changed the movement to using the space bar to move forward and alt and ctrl to move sideways, it would fail because it's not even remotely comfortable to use.

                  Using your left hand to move while simultaneously using your right hand on the mouse is good design. And if you're left-handed, I'm sure you can configure a game like WoW to work exactly the opposite, since you can remap every single keybind on there. So you'd be using your mouse with your left hand and OKL; lol. Part of good UI design is comfort and ease of use. If it were a tradition to use a shitty setup that wasn't comfortable, a few nostalgiafags would love it but everyone else would fawn over a new, more comfortable, more easy control scheme. Stop asking like WASD hasn't been successful because it's actually comfortable for most people to use and that it's just some rich tradition keeping it alive.
                  sigpic
                  ~Aksannyi~~Hades~~75WHM~75RDM~75BLM~75SMN~73WAR~67SCH~47BRD~
                  ~Mama Gamer~~Quitted July 2009/Bannt October 2009~~Excellence LS~
                  ~I has a blog~~http://aksannyi.livejournal.com/~
                  ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~ ~~




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                  • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

                    Originally posted by DakAttack View Post
                    Yea, it's called tradition. It's the same reason why female circumcision is still practiced in certain cultures.
                    No it isn't. The keyboard layout itself is tradition. Why the fuck won't the industry change it? For that matter, why does it still resemble a typewriter's layout?

                    In my opinion, what's been in practice for over a hundred years with billions of people around the world, shouldn't need to be changed for a subset of a few thousand self-proclaimed non-conformists.

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                    • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

                      This thread needs more Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums injected back into it...

                      Hereby requesting said costume.

                      I still lurk on the official forums but since the game is back up the entertainment factor has lessened.
                      This was pretty entertaining. It started out as a modest "Pet job adjustments" thread, then somehow turned into a thread about melee SMN. I was willing to hear this Dallas guy out until he started grasping at straws, especially one about how SMN has more "innate" Haste than WAR because it has Hastega.

                      Hastega! We've made progress! You've finally acknowledged a JOB ABILITY of SMN. Yes, any top SMN will have 13% more haste than any top WAR unless that SMN is too dumb to use the best available buffs to them.

                      Sure, with the addition of another job, WAR can be brought up to speed, pun intended. See my OP if you actualy intend to join my cause, but you don't get to rely on outside help in this discussion.

                      Next, Hastega comes from *what*? What SMN ability have you completely ignored in order to prove you are a better DD as a gimp WAR?
                      sigpic

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                      • Re: Official FINAL FANTASY XI Forums Launch! (03/08/2011)

                        Hello all.

                        I don't even remember what I've posted about a few years ago on this forum, but I remembered liking reading discussions going about and agreeing with much of what was being said.
                        This is still the case today.

                        As I reactivated my account a few weeks ago, I felt it a good time to come back from time to time and see what was being discussed

                        - - - - -
                        Now back to FFXI !

                        Wow, now did FFXI change a lot or what ?
                        240 spaces for items on my character ? wicked cool !
                        Abyssea --> Nope don't like it much; level 30 is way too soon (and everyone is doing it, urrgh).
                        For the rest, it still feel as cozy as it did back in 2009.

                        Had to farm my @ss off tho because I messed-up world transfer and SE Support telling me "You Suck! Just wait 90 days" and only have one of my character transfered to Asura, but the economy is quite good over there, so it keeps me busy. It's a good change from FF14 (nothing to do in there, wtf), and so far I've been enjoying it a lot.

                        The only thing missing is that I'm not having any parties to do "Classic FFXI" with.
                        Zones like Dunes, Qufim Island, Khazam (love that place personally), Garleige, Boyahda Tree (only went there once; was so much fun !).
                        Actually not entirely correct, i'm getting invite to book burns with doubles PLs... I hate PL-ing...

                        If anyone is going to play on Asura, let me know. I'm game for some party play (level-sync'ed or otherwise, but no PL please).

                        FrancoisX
                        -- aka Samuriko / Goerkhan, Asura Server.
                        Last edited by FrancoisX; 10-05-2011, 04:27 PM.
                        Active Server: Asura
                        Active Characters: Samuriko, Goerkhan

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